DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

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DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by architect »

The title says it all; I wanted to start a thread to specifically track any changes taking place with the Albertsons DFW brands, as DFW is the only market in which Albertsons is currently maintaining three brands with three distinct markets (SoCal aside, as Vons and Pavillions both came out of the Safeway fold and are very similar).

First of all, at multiple Tom Thumbs I have visited over the past couple of weeks, the "upgraded" lighting previously discussed on the "Integration of Albertsons/Safeway" thread has been cut back. On several occasions, I have seen portions of newly installed fixtures turned off completely, likely due to customer complaints. The most notable instance of this was at the Preston/Frankfort location, where 2/3 rows of new fluorescent strips were off completely in the floral department, and the recessed cans in this area were turned back on. This same store also had several fixtures turned off near the deli/bakery counters, directly above display cases.

I also visited the Park/Preston Market Street today, and noticed an interesting store-brand mix with Signature items gradually replacing Essential Everyday, while also being supplemented by United's own brands. Here is what I observed:

1. Red River Farms milk and ice cream are both still available. On the milk side, there were no signs of the brand being replaced. For the ice cream, the private-brand selection was a mix of Red River Farms for half gallons and Lucerne for bulk packages.
2. Kristal bottled water has been entirely replaced by the Safeway/Albertsons Refreshe brand.
3. No signs of Arriba coffee, however, this could have been easily glanced over. Also, several Signature Select coffees were available.
4. Both Hearth of Texas bread and United's Mi Pueblo tortillas are still available (and at least the tortillas are likely here to stay, as I recently saw these in a Tom Thumb).
5. Outside of United's own brands, private-brand products were roughly split 50/50 between Signature Kitchens/Signature Select and Essential Everyday.

Also, the pricing has dropped substantially on both private and name brand products since my last visit.
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by arizonaguy »

architect wrote:The title says it all; I wanted to start a thread to specifically track any changes taking place with the Albertsons DFW brands, as DFW is the only market in which Albertsons is currently maintaining three brands with three distinct markets (SoCal aside, as Vons and Pavillions both came out of the Safeway fold and are very similar).

First of all, at multiple Tom Thumbs I have visited over the past couple of weeks, the "upgraded" lighting previously discussed on the "Integration of Albertsons/Safeway" thread has been cut back. On several occasions, I have seen portions of newly installed fixtures turned off completely, likely due to customer complaints. The most notable instance of this was at the Preston/Frankfort location, where 2/3 rows of new fluorescent strips were off completely in the floral department, and the recessed cans in this area were turned back on. This same store also had several fixtures turned off near the deli/bakery counters, directly above display cases.

I also visited the Park/Preston Market Street today, and noticed an interesting store-brand mix with Signature items gradually replacing Essential Everyday, while also being supplemented by United's own brands. Here is what I observed:

1. Red River Farms milk and ice cream are both still available. On the milk side, there were no signs of the brand being replaced. For the ice cream, the private-brand selection was a mix of Red River Farms for half gallons and Lucerne for bulk packages.
2. Kristal bottled water has been entirely replaced by the Safeway/Albertsons Refreshe brand.
3. No signs of Arriba coffee, however, this could have been easily glanced over. Also, several Signature Select coffees were available.
4. Both Hearth of Texas bread and United's Mi Pueblo tortillas are still available (and at least the tortillas are likely here to stay, as I recently saw these in a Tom Thumb).
5. Outside of United's own brands, private-brand products were roughly split 50/50 between Signature Kitchens/Signature Select and Essential Everyday.

Also, the pricing has dropped substantially on both private and name brand products since my last visit.
Wow. It's interesting to see that the lighting changes were cut back. That isn't the case at all here in Arizona, where the stores are brighter than ever. I think most customers over here find it to be positive, especially compared to the Fry's stores here which can get incredibly dark, especially the old "Dillons" designed stores.

It's also interesting to see the private label mix at Park/Preston. I went to that store in late September and there was a mix of Essential Everyday / Signature (Kitchens/Home) then too, although far more Essential Everyday.

What are United's brands? Do they have manufacturing facilities or are they a Topco or AWG or other private label brand that United has a contract with. When I was there in September I didn't really notice that United had its own brands.
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by pseudo3d »

arizonaguy wrote:
architect wrote:The title says it all; I wanted to start a thread to specifically track any changes taking place with the Albertsons DFW brands, as DFW is the only market in which Albertsons is currently maintaining three brands with three distinct markets (SoCal aside, as Vons and Pavillions both came out of the Safeway fold and are very similar).

First of all, at multiple Tom Thumbs I have visited over the past couple of weeks, the "upgraded" lighting previously discussed on the "Integration of Albertsons/Safeway" thread has been cut back. On several occasions, I have seen portions of newly installed fixtures turned off completely, likely due to customer complaints. The most notable instance of this was at the Preston/Frankfort location, where 2/3 rows of new fluorescent strips were off completely in the floral department, and the recessed cans in this area were turned back on. This same store also had several fixtures turned off near the deli/bakery counters, directly above display cases.

I also visited the Park/Preston Market Street today, and noticed an interesting store-brand mix with Signature items gradually replacing Essential Everyday, while also being supplemented by United's own brands. Here is what I observed:

1. Red River Farms milk and ice cream are both still available. On the milk side, there were no signs of the brand being replaced. For the ice cream, the private-brand selection was a mix of Red River Farms for half gallons and Lucerne for bulk packages.
2. Kristal bottled water has been entirely replaced by the Safeway/Albertsons Refreshe brand.
3. No signs of Arriba coffee, however, this could have been easily glanced over. Also, several Signature Select coffees were available.
4. Both Hearth of Texas bread and United's Mi Pueblo tortillas are still available (and at least the tortillas are likely here to stay, as I recently saw these in a Tom Thumb).
5. Outside of United's own brands, private-brand products were roughly split 50/50 between Signature Kitchens/Signature Select and Essential Everyday.

Also, the pricing has dropped substantially on both private and name brand products since my last visit.
Wow. It's interesting to see that the lighting changes were cut back. That isn't the case at all here in Arizona, where the stores are brighter than ever. I think most customers over here find it to be positive, especially compared to the Fry's stores here which can get incredibly dark, especially the old "Dillons" designed stores.

It's also interesting to see the private label mix at Park/Preston. I went to that store in late September and there was a mix of Essential Everyday / Signature (Kitchens/Home) then too, although far more Essential Everyday.

What are United's brands? Do they have manufacturing facilities or are they a Topco or AWG or other private label brand that United has a contract with. When I was there in September I didn't really notice that United had its own brands.
United has one manufacturing facility called Praters Foods in Lubbock. It primarily does prepared foods and up to the Safeway merger had a variety of clients, most of which weren't Albertsons/Safeway at all (AWG, Costco, Kroger, Winn-Dixie). They did have a line of tortillas exclusive to United.

As for brands, besides the Topco (and later SuperValu) brands, United had a few exclusive brands, including a brand of coffee called Arriba!, dairy products labeled as Red River Farms, baked goods called Hearth of Texas, and a bottled water brand called Kristal. These were all on a webpage on the United website, however, they recently changed to a page where it mostly showed off the Signature brand items, so I wrote architect a PM asking about the status of what made United brands special.
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by architect »

Below are photos from my shopping trip earlier today. The first photo is of the Tom Thumb lighting mentioned in my original post. Initially, I expected this to just be a fluke, but I have noticed it at multiple stores, and in strategic areas at that. The rest are photos of the United brand products previously discussed (plus a gallon of Good Day milk).

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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by pseudo3d »

architect wrote:Below are photos from my shopping trip earlier today. The first photo is of the Tom Thumb lighting mentioned in my original post. Initially, I expected this to just be a fluke, but I have noticed it at multiple stores, and in strategic areas at that. The rest are photos of the United brand products previously discussed (plus a gallon of Good Day milk).
Huh. Considering that the Albertsons (in Louisiana) I was at last October was busy phasing out Good Day (a legacy Albertsons brand, but owned by SuperValu now) in favor of Pantry Essentials (already the nametag was gone), I was surprised to see it in your photos (though Albertsons Louisiana had it at more than twice the price, due to arcane Louisiana milk laws). Additionally, I was also taken aback to see that Hearth of Texas is a low-end brand and not a nicer house brand that I had suspected of being.

I think the ultimate plan for Tom Thumb, Albertsons, and Market Street is that the two will remain separate divisions, much like existing Safeway and ACME stores in the Northeast, and the Albertsons stores will become Tom Thumb, though not until the Tom Thumb prices go down and the card disappears.
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by arizonaguy »

pseudo3d wrote:
architect wrote:Below are photos from my shopping trip earlier today. The first photo is of the Tom Thumb lighting mentioned in my original post. Initially, I expected this to just be a fluke, but I have noticed it at multiple stores, and in strategic areas at that. The rest are photos of the United brand products previously discussed (plus a gallon of Good Day milk).
Huh. Considering that the Albertsons (in Louisiana) I was at last October was busy phasing out Good Day (a legacy Albertsons brand, but owned by SuperValu now) in favor of Pantry Essentials (already the nametag was gone), I was surprised to see it in your photos (though Albertsons Louisiana had it at more than twice the price, due to arcane Louisiana milk laws). Additionally, I was also taken aback to see that Hearth of Texas is a low-end brand and not a nicer house brand that I had suspected of being.

I think the ultimate plan for Tom Thumb, Albertsons, and Market Street is that the two will remain separate divisions, much like existing Safeway and ACME stores in the Northeast, and the Albertsons stores will become Tom Thumb, though not until the Tom Thumb prices go down and the card disappears.
I haven't seen Good Day milk in Arizona in several years. In fact, I think Good Day got phased out around the same time that Albertsons LLC took over the stores from Albertsons Inc. Since that time, the only private label milk I've seen at Albertsons stores in Arizona is Albertsons brand milk.

It appears that both the Good Day milk and the Red River Farms milk in the photos above are manufactured at the same dairy plant.
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by wnetmacman »

arizonaguy wrote:I haven't seen Good Day milk in Arizona in several years. In fact, I think Good Day got phased out around the same time that Albertsons LLC took over the stores from Albertsons Inc.
It all depends on where you live. Each region has different suppliers for Dairy, Bread and the like. That's why Good Day survived in Louisiana for as long as it did; our Milk supplier is still making the labels.
pseudo3d wrote:(though Albertsons Louisiana had it at more than twice the price, due to arcane Louisiana milk laws)
Gotta love it. We also have laws protecting the florist monopoly too. Essentially, Florist is a licensed position in Louisiana. To even SELL flowers in the store, you have to have a licensed florist on staff. I knew someone who was licensed and teaching classes in how to become licensed. Because the market was saturated, they failed three of her entire classes.
pseudo3d wrote:I think the ultimate plan for Tom Thumb, Albertsons, and Market Street is that the two will remain separate divisions, much like existing Safeway and ACME stores in the Northeast, and the Albertsons stores will become Tom Thumb, though not until the Tom Thumb prices go down and the card disappears.
IIRC, the condition of the sale of United to Albertsons, LLC, was that the United division stayed separately managed. I don't know if Albertsons will abandon any banners in any area; that's part of what was so screwed up about this entire merger situation. Albertsons and Safeway were direct competitors in many markets, with many different nameplates. I don't see losing Randalls in Houston because Albertsons already failed there. Tom Thumb and Albertsons run fairly neck and neck in Dallas. United and Market Street won't be going anywhere.
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/Market Street Observations

Post by architect »

arizonaguy wrote:It appears that both the Good Day milk and the Red River Farms milk in the photos above are manufactured at the same dairy plant.
There are several Albertsons stores in West Texas which have been transitioned into the United division. As a result, the Good Day milk was likely being manufactured for the Albertsons stores being served by United. It was still surprising though, as I have not seen the Good Day brand in years (even at DFW Albertsons stores, which I have only been to a couple).
wnetmacman wrote:
pseudo3d wrote:I think the ultimate plan for Tom Thumb, Albertsons, and Market Street is that the two will remain separate divisions, much like existing Safeway and ACME stores in the Northeast, and the Albertsons stores will become Tom Thumb, though not until the Tom Thumb prices go down and the card disappears.
IIRC, the condition of the sale of United to Albertsons, LLC, was that the United division stayed separately managed. I don't know if Albertsons will abandon any banners in any area; that's part of what was so screwed up about this entire merger situation. Albertsons and Safeway were direct competitors in many markets, with many different nameplates. I don't see losing Randalls in Houston because Albertsons already failed there. Tom Thumb and Albertsons run fairly neck and neck in Dallas. United and Market Street won't be going anywhere.
In Houston/Austin, I don't see Albertsons making major changes with Randalls, unless if they decide to shut down the division completely. Hopefully we might finally see some new store/remodel investment in these areas. In DFW, Albertsons is in a bit of a pickle, as previously discussed. Due to the United sale agreement, the Market Stores will likely remain independent for the most part, at least for the foreseeable feature. The Tom Thumb and Albertsons brands are not really compatible with one-another for the following reasons:

1. The Tom Thumb brand is well entrenched in Dallas (especially in the Park Cities and North Dallas, where land is scarce and expensive) and in the wealthy northern suburbs, while Albertsons is much more dominant in Fort Worth with Tom Thumb only having a few locations.
2. In the DFW area, Albertsons has a reputation for dingy, outdated stores which haven't seen a renovation in years. This is a turnoff for pickier shoppers, especially in the wealthiest parts of the Metroplex. In most of the areas where Albertsons is successful, competing stores are either outdated (especially old Kroger locations) or nonexistent. Tom Thumb has a much more upscale reputation, but is also known for high pricing (both real and perceived).
3. Tom Thumb's workforce is unionized from the Safeway days, while Albertsons is not. This may make it difficult to integrate the two banners.

Overall, I see the Albertsons banner being the most likely to be eliminated in DFW, especially if HEB makes a market entry and is able to steal from the middle-class suburban customer base which Albertsons does well with. If permissible by the United sale agreement, I could also see Albertsons converting a couple of the larger inner-city Tom Thumb locations to Market Street, especially in areas where several Tom Thumb stores are located in close proximity to one-another (the Lovers/Greenville and Preston/Forest locations immediately come to mind, as both are large stores which could accommodate the Market Street format). This would allow for Albertsons to bring in customers who have been turned away by Tom Thumb's high pricing reputation, while also expanding the Market Street brand which has continued to be successful.

Speaking of the Preston/Forest Tom Thumb, I am curious to see if Albertsons has unannounced plans for this location, as it has still not received the lighting "upgrade" that most of the other local stores have (as of earlier today), and is also very well-trafficked. It also located near another (smaller) Tom Thumb at Preston/Royal, making the two stores somewhat redundant.
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by storewanderer »

Eventually they might make some kind of common ground on the labor situation in the stores. Is United union or non-union?

With the drug stores as we discussed over on that thread, long ago in California the union Thrifty merged with the non-union Payless then bought out by Rite Aid. Ultimately under Rite Aid the decision was made to just unionize the whole thing. A similar thing happened when Save Mart bought NorCal Albertsons; while Albertsons NorCal was all union, Save Mart was part union and part non union for its entire operation (stores, distribution, etc.). Save Mart made the decision at least with the stores to go all union and just be done with it.

Maybe California laws impact this somewhat since it is not a right to work state so comparing the activities on this topic in California to those that may or may not happen in Texas is not relevant?
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Re: DFW Tom Thumb/Albertsons/MArket Street Observations

Post by architect »

storewanderer wrote:Eventually they might make some kind of common ground on the labor situation in the stores. Is United union or non-union?

With the drug stores as we discussed over on that thread, long ago in California the union Thrifty merged with the non-union Payless then bought out by Rite Aid. Ultimately under Rite Aid the decision was made to just unionize the whole thing. A similar thing happened when Save Mart bought NorCal Albertsons; while Albertsons NorCal was all union, Save Mart was part union and part non union for its entire operation (stores, distribution, etc.). Save Mart made the decision at least with the stores to go all union and just be done with it.

Maybe California laws impact this somewhat since it is not a right to work state so comparing the activities on this topic in California to those that may or may not happen in Texas is not relevant?
United is non-union, as are almost all grocers in the region except for Kroger and the former Safeway-owned chains. Also, I definitely agree that since Texas is a right to work state, this union vs. non-union issue may be much less significant.
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