Wegmans (and other modern supermarkets) in malls

[pseudo3d]

Sometime in the period following major anchor consolidations (like Macy's) and the loss of stores following the Great Recession, talk came up about re-inviting supermarkets back to malls, having been kicked out a number of years ago from mainstream malls (neighborhood mini-malls and dying 1960s centers notwithstanding) and since then having averaging their square footage to mainstream anchors (in general, department stores have shrunk and supermarkets have grown) but while I hear noise about it every once in a while (like a mall in California adding an H&M to a dead Robinsons-May and talking about adding a supermarket, though that was a few years ago), I have rarely seen it in practice. Every time I hear about it, it's usually never connected to the interior, because it's either in a lifestyle component or another exterior facing structure (like a Sears sub-leasing space). A few years ago, a Wegmans even opened in the Montgomery Mall in North Wales, PA, except it actually didn't, with the place where the entrance would be sealed off with more retail space. (This bodes poorly for Natick Mall's upcoming Wegmans)

I don't think it's problems with the time incompatibilities or anything, I remember the pharmacy entrance near my H-E-B only had one checkout area (and possible another LP/greeter person hanging around), and that was sealed off after dark (which I can imagine also working for a mall entrance).

[ValuedCustomer]

Kroger was proposed to take over one level of a large Sears store at the Cumberland Mall in Atlanta to replace their outdated store down the road but the plan was abandoned. This is a mall that has been proactive in reinventing itself as there is a Costco at the other end of the mall (no interior mall entrance) that replaced a JCPenney and the original Macy's (Davison's) anchor was torn down and replaced with a bunch of restaurants (Maggiano's, PF Chang). I was disappointed when the plan was scrapped as I'd like to have seen how they would have configured it. Supermarkets were part of the original malls back in the 1960s (I remember a remnant of this in the Acme that was at King of Prussia mall until at least the late 80s) and are still common in other countries of course.

[SamSpade]

"365 by Whole Foods" is coming to one level of the Bellevue Square former JCPenney anchor.
As far as I can gather, the store would have entrances off the adjacent (small) garage as well as into the mall.
http://www.seattletimes.com/business/re ... september/
I would think having Wild Ginger Kitchen near the mall entrance would be a draw, as Bellevue Square is one of the few large malls with no food 'court' area but instead forcing food vendors to rent traditional retail spaces throughout the center.

This seems to be one way that Bellevue Square wants to help open itself up better to the sidewalk and the adjacent Kemper Development owned properties. Currently when you drive by it, there is a slightly recessed mall entrance which includes a Red Robin on the left and Cheesecake Factory on the right.

The new rendering of the former blank to the road JCPenney is this:
http://425magazine.com/365-by-whole-foo ... ue-square/
http://bellevue.com/article.php?id=299

[wnetmacman]

(no interior mall entrance)

When this has happened, and will happen, this phrase will be common.

Here in Lafayette, LA, Albertsons added a store in 1997 to the nearly dead Northgate Mall. For those of you unfamiliar with our area, Northgate was built in the early 60's with Montgomery Ward and JCPenney as anchors, with Wilson's/Service Merchandise added later. JCPenney moved to the Acadiana Mall in the 80's and left a dead hulk of a store. Albertsons tore that store down and built their own on the site, but with no interior mall entrance, and bricks over the old JCP entrance. Rumor was that at the time, K&B/Rite Aid were in the mall, and they threatened to leave over a long known clause in their lease that made them the exclusive pharmacy in the mall. Albertsons (barely) outlasted the Rite Aid, but neither are now open there.

[pseudo3d]

(no interior mall entrance)

When this has happened, and will happen, this phrase will be common.

Here in Lafayette, LA, Albertsons added a store in 1997 to the nearly dead Northgate Mall. For those of you unfamiliar with our area, Northgate was built in the early 60's with Montgomery Ward and JCPenney as anchors, with Wilson's/Service Merchandise added later. JCPenney moved to the Acadiana Mall in the 80's and left a dead hulk of a store. Albertsons tore that store down and built their own on the site, but with no interior mall entrance, and bricks over the old JCP entrance. Rumor was that at the time, K&B/Rite Aid were in the mall, and they threatened to leave over a long known clause in their lease that made them the exclusive pharmacy in the mall. Albertsons (barely) outlasted the Rite Aid, but neither are now open there.

I strongly doubt that Albertsons would've opened into the mall given the opportunity. A lot of supermarkets near malls or on the property that have opened in the last past 20 years have either no mall entrance or not even physically connected with stores (same with big box hardware stores, too, as I only know of of ONE Home Depot that opens into a mall and not even sure it still does, that would be Mall 205). Hardware stores are a pretty bad example because they're so different in and of themselves, they are usually dusty warehouses that do not easily lend themselves to the rest of the mall (and I think that malls would rather not have day laborers hang outside on weekends, but I'm just guessing here), while supermarkets do have appeal because food (like in food courts) and a somewhat comparable merchandise mix in terms of HBA and other general merchandise (drug stores tended to last much longer in malls than supermarkets did).

What I'm less clear on is if the separation between mall and supermarket is more to blame on malls or more to blame on supermarkets. I would tend to think the latter based on how stingy they are with how their entrances are, but the same supermarkets often try to fit themselves into new layouts like more urban stores, so I can't imagine why they couldn't do something different for a change.

[architect]

Kroger was proposed to take over one level of a large Sears store at the Cumberland Mall in Atlanta to replace their outdated store down the road but the plan was abandoned. This is a mall that has been proactive in reinventing itself as there is a Costco at the other end of the mall (no interior mall entrance) that replaced a JCPenney and the original Macy's (Davison's) anchor was torn down and replaced with a bunch of restaurants (Maggiano's, PF Chang). I was disappointed when the plan was scrapped as I'd like to have seen how they would have configured it. Supermarkets were part of the original malls back in the 1960s (I remember a remnant of this in the Acme that was at King of Prussia mall until at least the late 80s) and are still common in other countries of course.

Even though the Cumberland Mall plans have fallen apart for now, it would not surprise me to see management attempt to court Kroger again in a couple of years, especially once Sears goes out of business. Supermarkets are reliable traffic generators, and this would be a great move for all parties involved, especially with SunTrust Park being constructed nearby. The existing Greenhouse to the south is also in an awkward location as it is located at an extremely busy intersection, with poor visibility and access from Cobb Parkway due to the store being situated at a much lower elevation than the adjacent roadway.

[wnetmacman]

I strongly doubt that Albertsons would've opened into the mall given the opportunity. A lot of supermarkets near malls or on the property that have opened in the last past 20 years have either no mall entrance or not even physically connected with stores (same with big box hardware stores, too, as I only know of of ONE Home Depot that opens into a mall and not even sure it still does, that would be Mall 205).

Albertsons did want a mall entrance, thinking (very prophetically) that a lack of it would stop mall shoppers from going to the store. It was K&B/Rite Aid that stopped it because of the lease. When Rite Aid closed the store, Albertsons was in Split-the-company mode, and didn't want to spend money to open the doors up because the store was bleeding money already.

What I'm less clear on is if the separation between mall and supermarket is more to blame on malls or more to blame on supermarkets. I would tend to think the latter based on how stingy they are with how their entrances are, but the same supermarkets often try to fit themselves into new layouts like more urban stores, so I can't imagine why they couldn't do something different for a change.

I remember back to the late 70's when I saw my first (and only) mall supermarket. It had been an IGA store situated in a small midwestern mall. It had both inside and outside mall entrances. The inside was a wide open wall; if the wall was open, the whole supermarket was exposed. What you've said is correct about entrances, to a point. Supermarket operators don't want to have to police different entrances on a mall store; many times the supermarket will be situated with the front facing the road and a side to the mall; it's hard to make that work. I only saw a few discounters truly make it work the way it was meant to; Kmart and Walmart being among them. Kmart just faced the front of the store into the mall entrance. Beyond the doors, there was no difference inside the store. Walmart took a different approach, setting up a few registers at the mall entry, but with the front of the store still being the main entrance, with the service desk. Walmart's way disrupted the flow of the store by putting registers in the middle of clothes.

Where am I going with this?

Most grocers won't give up the side peripheral space to put in Mall registers, and most malls don't want grocery carts going down the mallway. So I blame the lack of grocers in malls on both sides.

[pseudo3d]

Kroger was proposed to take over one level of a large Sears store at the Cumberland Mall in Atlanta to replace their outdated store down the road but the plan was abandoned. This is a mall that has been proactive in reinventing itself as there is a Costco at the other end of the mall (no interior mall entrance) that replaced a JCPenney and the original Macy's (Davison's) anchor was torn down and replaced with a bunch of restaurants (Maggiano's, PF Chang). I was disappointed when the plan was scrapped as I'd like to have seen how they would have configured it. Supermarkets were part of the original malls back in the 1960s (I remember a remnant of this in the Acme that was at King of Prussia mall until at least the late 80s) and are still common in other countries of course.

Even though the Cumberland Mall plans have fallen apart for now, it would not surprise me to see management attempt to court Kroger again in a couple of years, especially once Sears goes out of business. Supermarkets are reliable traffic generators, and this would be a great move for all parties involved, especially with SunTrust Park being constructed nearby. The existing Greenhouse to the south is also in an awkward location as it is located at an extremely busy intersection, with poor visibility and access from Cobb Parkway due to the store being situated at a much lower elevation than the adjacent roadway.

If Sears closes that location, that's it, the current space is way too big for Kroger itself (the space is 192,000 square feet on two levels, so I assume Kroger will take up a good part of the first level while leaving Sears the mall entrance), and while the chances were slim that Kroger would co-opt an entrance into the mall with Sears, there's even less chance that they would do it to a dying mall (especially as Costco has alrady turned its back). Unless Kroger was obliged with some massive incentive on the mall's part, they would likely demolish the entire building for a stand-alone building on the footprint but no mall entrance.

Albertsons did want a mall entrance, thinking (very prophetically) that a lack of it would stop mall shoppers from going to the store. It was K&B/Rite Aid that stopped it because of the lease. When Rite Aid closed the store, Albertsons was in Split-the-company mode, and didn't want to spend money to open the doors up because the store was bleeding money already.

Albertsons stores of the time tended to be built with one entrance and one exit at different points of the store (a lot of Houston division stores were built this way) and while I imagine that probably wasn't a fast and true case (especially since for a few stores they had an additional entrance for the lawn and garden department), I'm more inclined that they would just build a exit into the mall and not a full entrance, and if they were to do the mall, they would do like Kmart and the northeast discounters (Hills, Caldor, Bradlees) did what you describe, basically build a mall entrance directly in front of the store's entrance (for the Westfield Wheaton Costco, this is what they did as well). Compounding this is that Albertsons stores weren't known for taking a lot of risks with unusual stores at the time.

Walmart took a different approach, setting up a few registers at the mall entry, but with the front of the store still being the main entrance, with the service desk. Walmart's way disrupted the flow of the store by putting registers in the middle of clothes.

Over the course of history, the number of Walmart stores with mall entrances are pretty small. The only ones I can think of Manor East Mall (Bryan, TX) which from what I've read had what you described (it didn't last much longer than a decade before moving out to a Supercenter in 1993), and Chris-Town Mall (later Phoenix Spectrum Mall and Christown Spectrum Mall), which expanded to a Supercenter.

Most grocers won't give up the side peripheral space to put in Mall registers, and most malls don't want grocery carts going down the mallway. So I blame the lack of grocers in malls on both sides.

It's not hard to put up anti-cart posts in malls (Memorial City Mall did that in Houston), and Target is in more malls than anything else (not to mention the once-ubiquitous-to-malls Sears even tried shopping carts back in the early 2000s, I see a few of them kicking around the mall parking lot).

[Brian Lutz]

The former JCPenney space the 365 store is coming to is off to the side of the mall in an area that gets much less traffic than the main NE 8th St / Bellevue Way area that most of the existing Kemper property borders on, and the Bellevue Downtown Park is across the street from there, That park is one of the nicer parks in town and has been undergoing a recent renovation, but at the same time has also become a major hotspot for Pokemon Go, so it has been getting a lot of traffic lately.

[klkla]

Most grocers won't give up the side peripheral space to put in Mall registers, and most malls don't want grocery carts going down the mallway. So I blame the lack of grocers in malls on both sides.

I don't think the malls would have much if any objections to paying tenants that bring in a lot of foot traffic.

Quite a few supermarkets tried going into large malls in the late 1950's and the 1960's but it ultimately didn't work out because the large malls with department stores as anchors are more regional in nature and pull traffic from a wider area but less often. Grocery stores need to pull shoppers in much more frequently and it just wasn't a good match and so they have built mostly in neighborhood shopping centers since.