Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Predicting the demise of Sears & Kmart since 2017!
pseudo3d
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by pseudo3d »

wnetmacman wrote: I have not felt like I was in an old Target in any Kmart, ever. Especially since 2002. The stores of 1990-1997 felt more like Walmart of the time, and Sam Walton even acknowledged that he was concerned with the current management at that time because that was the only era that made an effort to upgrade everything.
Well, at least reminded of one ("Felt" is definitely too kind). Unpretentious, 1990s, and smelling of popcorn, though it was also Wal-Mart like, though Wal-Mart always smelled dirtier. The real 1990s Target stores were great, if only a bit small and missing some departments.
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by storewanderer »

What Targets have I been in that felt like a Kmart? The two I went into in Canada, one of which was near Vancouver Airport in a very second or maybe even third tier mall in Richmond, a second out in Chilliwack. They may have even been former Kmarts...

Older Targets have a certain odor of popcorn but it isn't what I call an unpleasant odor.

Older Kmarts have an odor and I don't think it is pleasant. Plus many of the Kmarts haven't been serving popcorn in well over a decade.
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by wnetmacman »

storewanderer wrote:What Targets have I been in that felt like a Kmart? The two I went into in Canada, one of which was near Vancouver Airport in a very second or maybe even third tier mall in Richmond, a second out in Chilliwack. They may have even been former Kmarts...

Older Targets have a certain odor of popcorn but it isn't what I call an unpleasant odor.

Older Kmarts have an odor and I don't think it is pleasant. Plus many of the Kmarts haven't been serving popcorn in well over a decade.
The older Kmart smell is more one of the rubber in the shoe department. I have never been in a Kmart that didn't smell like that.
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by mbz321 »

pseudo3d wrote:\\

With the deflation in the grocery industry, I think that Target should've taken a hard look at P-Fresh and decided to not double down on it and focus instead in actually rebuilding a comprehensive merchandise mix in a store that looks and feels nice. That's what Target was at its best, even if the selection wasn't as deep or quite as cheap as Wal-Mart, it had a lot of nicer items and a good presentation (coffeemakers on display, etc.), but that's not really the case anymore.
P-Fresh was a complete mistake....I still wonder what genius thought that replacing high-margin dry goods with low-margin groceries was a great idea. I could see it working in certain locations, but almost every Target in my area has at least one grocery store within a mile of it, sometimes even adjoining a Target. A few aisles and a couple coolers for convenience items, fine. 'Fresh' prepackaged meat and a ton of produce items that are priced way higher than anyone else? Get rid of it...nobody is biting, even when I notice markdown stickers on almost all of the fresh items.

I have pretty much given up shopping at Target as others have said, the selection of non-food goods has gone to complete crap. Their clothing, at least in the Men's department, is way too expensive for what it is. Even the clearance clothing is way more expensive than similar clearance items at Kohl's or JCPenney. The quality of the merchandise is the same as Walmart and the employees aren't treated any better. I'm not sure what demographic Target is trying to appeal to today, but they seem lost trying to appeal to anyone anymore...I think the smaller 'flex' format' stores are a last ditch effort to bring some money in, before we start seeing some serious cutbacks happen.
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by storewanderer »

P-Fresh made sense in certain markets, like California. Those P-Fresh Departments do extremely well and are very high volume. They do so well, they have trouble staying in-stock. In markets with better grocers, and/or a more dominant Wal Mart presence, P-Fresh is just not going to play well.

I have noticed Target's clearance program no longer yields any real good deals. It is rare to see them go above 70% off and it appears they may run 90% off for a day or two on certain seasonal categories but in most cases what is happening is they just salvage items rather than go any lower on the price.

The service at Target has gotten quite disappointing/indifferent. Honestly, I find their employees to be as good as Wal Mart at the best, often times they are actually worse. But I don't have much of a problem with the employees at Wal Mart; the location near me, the employees are quite friendly. Not as efficient as they could be, but pleasant and friendly, and I see quite a few who have been there for a few years. And my comments earlier about employee dress code/uniform appearance going downhill from what it used to be, I do not know what happened there.
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by arizonaguy »

storewanderer wrote:P-Fresh made sense in certain markets, like California. Those P-Fresh Departments do extremely well and are very high volume. They do so well, they have trouble staying in-stock. In markets with better grocers, and/or a more dominant Wal Mart presence, P-Fresh is just not going to play well.

I have noticed Target's clearance program no longer yields any real good deals. It is rare to see them go above 70% off and it appears they may run 90% off for a day or two on certain seasonal categories but in most cases what is happening is they just salvage items rather than go any lower on the price.

The service at Target has gotten quite disappointing/indifferent. Honestly, I find their employees to be as good as Wal Mart at the best, often times they are actually worse. But I don't have much of a problem with the employees at Wal Mart; the location near me, the employees are quite friendly. Not as efficient as they could be, but pleasant and friendly, and I see quite a few who have been there for a few years. And my comments earlier about employee dress code/uniform appearance going downhill from what it used to be, I do not know what happened there.
Walmart seemed to be losing its sense of direction about 1-2 years ago (around the time of the closure of the Walmart Express stores) but it seems to be vastly improving. At least in the stores I've visited recently, the Walmart stores seem to be cleaner and more well stocked with friendlier employees. The Walmart near me is in a not so great neighborhood (Phoenix has weird pockets and the Walmart is in a bad pocket) but the employees seem committed and are friendly.

Target just seems lost. The company seems to want to be a "hip, urban, millennial focused" chain. However the vast majority of stores are suburban and are in areas where families shop. Target used to cater to this community but now I've found places like Ross, TJMaxx, Marshalls, and even Walmart serve this demographic better.

Walmart.com is actually a useful alternative to amazon.com for a lot of items. Target.com is clunky and is very lacking in selection.
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by rwsandiego »

arizonaguy wrote:
storewanderer wrote:P-Fresh made sense in certain markets, like California. Those P-Fresh Departments do extremely well and are very high volume. They do so well, they have trouble staying in-stock. In markets with better grocers, and/or a more dominant Wal Mart presence, P-Fresh is just not going to play well.

I have noticed Target's clearance program no longer yields any real good deals. It is rare to see them go above 70% off and it appears they may run 90% off for a day or two on certain seasonal categories but in most cases what is happening is they just salvage items rather than go any lower on the price.

The service at Target has gotten quite disappointing/indifferent. Honestly, I find their employees to be as good as Wal Mart at the best, often times they are actually worse. But I don't have much of a problem with the employees at Wal Mart; the location near me, the employees are quite friendly. Not as efficient as they could be, but pleasant and friendly, and I see quite a few who have been there for a few years. And my comments earlier about employee dress code/uniform appearance going downhill from what it used to be, I do not know what happened there.
Walmart seemed to be losing its sense of direction about 1-2 years ago (around the time of the closure of the Walmart Express stores) but it seems to be vastly improving. At least in the stores I've visited recently, the Walmart stores seem to be cleaner and more well stocked with friendlier employees. The Walmart near me is in a not so great neighborhood (Phoenix has weird pockets and the Walmart is in a bad pocket) but the employees seem committed and are friendly.
Is that the 40th Street and Thomas Rd Walmart? I'm not fond of the clientele, but that Walmart has a very good merchandise mix and the employees are very friendly. It is the closest one to me (live in downtown Phoenix) so I kind of put up and shut up.
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by Super S »

storewanderer wrote:What Targets have I been in that felt like a Kmart? The two I went into in Canada, one of which was near Vancouver Airport in a very second or maybe even third tier mall in Richmond, a second out in Chilliwack. They may have even been former Kmarts...

Older Targets have a certain odor of popcorn but it isn't what I call an unpleasant odor.

Older Kmarts have an odor and I don't think it is pleasant. Plus many of the Kmarts haven't been serving popcorn in well over a decade.
A few Target stores around Portland, OR & Vancouver, WA are showing some signs of neglect. One big one is the appearance of the floor tiles. There are sections which appear to be ok, but others where the tiles are cracking and you can clearly see dirt growing in the seams. I have also seen things like restrooms where they have soap sitting on the sink because dispensers are out, merchandise just sitting in the aisles to be put away, etc. Stuff like this was a big no-no when I briefly worked at Target in the early 1990s. As far as appearance of uniforms, I believe Target does not supply shirts, and employees may just be buying whatever is cheap to pass the dress code (Washington does not require employers to supply uniforms if they are a "common color" or something along those lines)
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by klkla »

Target is building a 22,000 sq. ft. store in the Koreatown area of Los Angeles at 6th & Virgil. Should be interesting to see how that turns out. That is not a particularly busy intersection considering Wilshire Blvd. is just one block south and won't benefit from as much drive-by traffic. But there are no other discount department stores in the immediate area. There's an old KMart a couple miles to the west at 3rd & Fairfax in the Fairfax district and a high volume City Target a mile or two east in Downtown L.A.

https://la.curbed.com/2017/2/16/1464030 ... next-sixth
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Re: Phoenix Flexible Format Target Opens

Post by arizonaguy »

rwsandiego wrote:The new flexible format Target at 16th and Camelback had its soft opening on 7/19 and I checked it out today, 7/20. I was underwhelmed.

The best thing I can say about it is the carts are new and roll smoothly. The grocery section didn't have much selection, but to their credit they are heavy on organics and natural items, which will play well in the area. That said, there's a Trader Joe's, Whole Foods, and Fry's within a few blocks of this store and Target closes at 10:00, so unless they beef up selection and drop prices, there will be no reason to buy groceries here. The cleaning products section wasn't great and from what I can tell the health and beauty wasn't, either. They should have nixed men's clothing and expanded cleaning products and groceries.

Had Target built in downtown Phoenix, which is more walkable and could use this type of store, I'd think it was a great store. However, if I have to drive to a store that might not have what I am looking for I might as well drive to a real Target.
I went to the store today and I wasn't impressed but I wasn't really disappointed either. For its size it seems to cover all of the bases. The problem is that other than offering a one stop experience, EVERY single item that this store sells is available within 3 blocks of this store at another retailer.

This Target has a Starbucks, there's also a large standalone Starbucks in its parking lot.
This Target has a CVS/Pharmacy, there's a very large (former Eckard) CVS/Pharmacy across the street.
This Target has HBA. The CVS/Parmacy across the street and the Fry's a few blocks away have larger HBA departments.
This Target has a small grocery section. There's a Fry's, a Trader Joe's, and a Whole Foods Market a few blocks away.
This Target has a liquor aisle. There's a Total Wine across the street.
This Target has a small electronics department. There's a Best Buy a few blocks away.

As far as clothing. There's a Marshall's and Nordstrom Rack within blocks of this store as well as a Macy's and Saks Fifth Avenue within 1 mile.

The reason this store even exists in the first place is that Target lost coverage of this area when it closed its store at 7th Ave. and Camelback Rd (2 miles West of here).

The other interesting thing about this store is the checkstand setup. There are 2 "regular" checkstands and 6 self checkout kiosks.
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