Whole Foods Amazon Prime 10% off

[ClownLoach]

I do not believe that Amazon has been as "hands on" as we might think at WFM. The direct Amazon changes are: adding online ordering through Amazon, moving delivery to Amazon employees, accepting Amazon returns, installing Amazon lockers, and using Prime service for discounts. Some stores getting Just Walk Out and Dash Carts. That's it.


But I firmly believe the most dangerous threat to the company has been the labor issues that erupted from efforts to modernize operations. I agree with the workers that some changes were too drastic like 100% standardization of all prepared foods to corporate recipes and elimination of store level autonomy for those areas. If the standard recipes were of the quality of some of the Chef driven originals then it would be fine, but the stuff they brought in is flavorless and expensive junk that looks like it was rejected by the Walmart Deli QA dept. But the rest needed to be done, some jobs did need to be changed and eliminated, systems like planograms and automatic ordering were needed. These employees went public in news stories and so badly damaged the reputation of the onetime premium Whole Foods brand that it may never recover. When reporters asked probing questions to gather details they just weren't there - complaining they can't stand around a table anymore and open up whatever product they want for demonstrations whether or not sales result, that they have to now follow standardized and engineered processes that have measurable results and expectations, and that they no longer can pass the company checkbook around like a joint at a Grateful Dead concert. There was no real substance to the accusations of the employees. I do wonder if the bad attitude and lack of cooperation in general led to the overly bland standardization of the recipes and such; that the employees wouldn't help the "greater good" of the company because of their overgrown egos. It's sad to see what has happened to Whole Foods.

Whole Foods was varying a lot by region on what it did with its fresh departments.

Northern California Whole Foods absolutely stuffed its fresh departments, piled them high, put a ton of labor into prepared foods, and otherwise did a truly outstanding job running what I'd call a "premium quality" supermarket. Deliveries came daily to resupply the stores with the freshest products. Local vendors supplemented it too. Pricing was in many cases lower than or equal to Safeway and that is part of what allowed them to get the market share they have in the bay area. Since Amazon the departments are still stuffed but freshness has suffered, a lot. Quality of fresh bakery, deli, etc. is varying somewhat by store with some doing a lot better than others.

Now recall Wild Oats. Wild Oats was a lot more controlled on its fresh departments. They didn't put much out to begin with. When something was on Wild Buy it was guaranteed to be out of stock after a couple days into the sale. They let stuff sit out until it was literally rotten. Bakery/deli made stuff when they felt like it and that meant very inconsistent selection from day to day and they also didn't seem to like to throw much away. They didn't really use local vendors and whatever came on the truck from their distribution center/wholesaler only came every 3-4 days and freshness was not great. I noticed after being converted from Wild Oats, some Whole Foods Stores specifically in NV, CO, and OK moved to a program where they had lightly stocked perimeters like Wild Oats, but the product freshness was still excellent and at a Whole Foods level.

Now with Amazon it seems like the worst of the two have happened. You have these full perimeters but you have to very closely watch product freshness. Prices seem to be at the highest levels ever. I can still find some excellent quality fresh items at Whole Foods, but before you didn't have to "find" those items- anything you picked up there was going to be excellent quality and of the highest freshness level imaginable. Now it is more of a buyer discretion type of store no different from a typical Kroger or Safeway type of place.

WFM has a separate Northern California division that operates NorCal, Northern Nevada and Idaho stores. I'd agree with you that the NorCal division used to run a better quality operation than the rest of the chain.

The key is that as part of the pre-merger streamlining to appease the activist shareholders they moved from having a parade of local vendors delivering to a distribution center process. So where some divisions like NorCal might have had access to really good local suppliers they would have been removed from the company. They were writing checks at each location and as a result there were wild swings in cost of goods sold and store margins. On top of that, with the mentality that somehow WFM is doing a greater good (instead of being a for profit supermarket) price increases weren't always passed on when the store would use a more expensive local source. The centralized sourcing is what drives the "no better than Kroger or Safeway" produce quality because they're buying the same stuff from the same vendors. Nobody at a big corporate office is calling Kenny's Little Farm to buy raspberries for store 123 and Fred's Family Farm to get them for store 456. They're calling Driscoll and saying we need raspberries for all of NorCal, X pallets per day, delivered to the warehouse. This again isn't necessarily something Amazon pushed through, but where the company had already decided it was going. The entire "Amazon ruined Whole Foods" thing is really all a bad timing coincidence. What they are now is what they would be without Amazon, they just wouldn't use Prime and take Amazon returns.

[buckguy]

I do not believe that Amazon has been as "hands on" as we might think at WFM. The direct Amazon changes are: adding online ordering through Amazon, moving delivery to Amazon employees, accepting Amazon returns, installing Amazon lockers, and using Prime service for discounts. Some stores getting Just Walk Out and Dash Carts. That's it.


But I firmly believe the most dangerous threat to the company has been the labor issues that erupted from efforts to modernize operations. I agree with the workers that some changes were too drastic like 100% standardization of all prepared foods to corporate recipes and elimination of store level autonomy for those areas. If the standard recipes were of the quality of some of the Chef driven originals then it would be fine, but the stuff they brought in is flavorless and expensive junk that looks like it was rejected by the Walmart Deli QA dept. But the rest needed to be done, some jobs did need to be changed and eliminated, systems like planograms and automatic ordering were needed. These employees went public in news stories and so badly damaged the reputation of the onetime premium Whole Foods brand that it may never recover. When reporters asked probing questions to gather details they just weren't there - complaining they can't stand around a table anymore and open up whatever product they want for demonstrations whether or not sales result, that they have to now follow standardized and engineered processes that have measurable results and expectations, and that they no longer can pass the company checkbook around like a joint at a Grateful Dead concert. There was no real substance to the accusations of the employees. I do wonder if the bad attitude and lack of cooperation in general led to the overly bland standardization of the recipes and such; that the employees wouldn't help the "greater good" of the company because of their overgrown egos. It's sad to see what has happened to Whole Foods.

Whole Foods was varying a lot by region on what it did with its fresh departments.

Northern California Whole Foods absolutely stuffed its fresh departments, piled them high, put a ton of labor into prepared foods, and otherwise did a truly outstanding job running what I'd call a "premium quality" supermarket. Deliveries came daily to resupply the stores with the freshest products. Local vendors supplemented it too. Pricing was in many cases lower than or equal to Safeway and that is part of what allowed them to get the market share they have in the bay area. Since Amazon the departments are still stuffed but freshness has suffered, a lot. Quality of fresh bakery, deli, etc. is varying somewhat by store with some doing a lot better than others.

Now recall Wild Oats. Wild Oats was a lot more controlled on its fresh departments. They didn't put much out to begin with. When something was on Wild Buy it was guaranteed to be out of stock after a couple days into the sale. They let stuff sit out until it was literally rotten. Bakery/deli made stuff when they felt like it and that meant very inconsistent selection from day to day and they also didn't seem to like to throw much away. They didn't really use local vendors and whatever came on the truck from their distribution center/wholesaler only came every 3-4 days and freshness was not great. I noticed after being converted from Wild Oats, some Whole Foods Stores specifically in NV, CO, and OK moved to a program where they had lightly stocked perimeters like Wild Oats, but the product freshness was still excellent and at a Whole Foods level.

Now with Amazon it seems like the worst of the two have happened. You have these full perimeters but you have to very closely watch product freshness. Prices seem to be at the highest levels ever. I can still find some excellent quality fresh items at Whole Foods, but before you didn't have to "find" those items- anything you picked up there was going to be excellent quality and of the highest freshness level imaginable. Now it is more of a buyer discretion type of store no different from a typical Kroger or Safeway type of place.

WFM has a separate Northern California division that operates NorCal, Northern Nevada and Idaho stores. I'd agree with you that the NorCal division used to run a better quality operation than the rest of the chain.

The key is that as part of the pre-merger streamlining to appease the activist shareholders they moved from having a parade of local vendors delivering to a distribution center process. So where some divisions like NorCal might have had access to really good local suppliers they would have been removed from the company. They were writing checks at each location and as a result there were wild swings in cost of goods sold and store margins. On top of that, with the mentality that somehow WFM is doing a greater good (instead of being a for profit supermarket) price increases weren't always passed on when the store would use a more expensive local source. The centralized sourcing is what drives the "no better than Kroger or Safeway" produce quality because they're buying the same stuff from the same vendors. Nobody at a big corporate office is calling Kenny's Little Farm to buy raspberries for store 123 and Fred's Family Farm to get them for store 456. They're calling Driscoll and saying we need raspberries for all of NorCal, X pallets per day, delivered to the warehouse. This again isn't necessarily something Amazon pushed through, but where the company had already decided it was going. The entire "Amazon ruined Whole Foods" thing is really all a bad timing coincidence. What they are now is what they would be without Amazon, they just wouldn't use Prime and take Amazon returns.

There's still some local variation in prepared items---I notice it with the baked goods in the DC area stores. For example, the muffins at the store near my workplace are different from the ones near where I live. The alterations to stores really vary, too. My workplace location is basically untouched, in terms of service departments and the store configuration has been altered only to add self-checkout. The one near where I live never had a full-time pizza operation, but now, they don't warm up slices, it's all self-serve---the pizza was barely edible before and remains so---no "chef recipe" there. The cheese area is only staffed during the day but the other prepared sections are unchanged. I've noticed changes in vendors for a number of things including ice cream--they no longer sell Graeter's, a premium brand from Ohio, but they do sell Jenni's, a rapidly expanding brand but mediocre overpriced brand, also from Ohio. Some of teh beer brands have come and gone and teh wine selection isn't as broad as it once was.

As for history, WF has been a mixed bag for as long as I've lived near one. I visited what was considered store #1 in Austin shortly before they came to Atlanta. The store probably was the original or an early replacement as it was a dark space in a strip mall in need of renovation and looked like it was probably cobbled together from multiple storefronts. The produce looked ok and they had high end meat as you'd expect, but the prepared food wasn't all that inspiring. I forget what I bought but it was pretty underwhelming.

When they came to Atlanta, they acquired a cult following, but again, they were pretty disappointing. The bakery and prepared foods were uneven--they had a broader selection of both than Publix and anything would have been better than Kroger. The produce was a little better than Publix (in turn, a bit better than Kroger) but still not great---I wasn't surprised, as produce in the Southeast is pretty awful which probably reflects the wholsale market and there isn't the kind of hobby farming, "back to the land" folks or things that elevate what's available locally-----DC has benefited from having that kind of infrastructure within 2-3 hours of the city, creating a robust farmer's market culture and raising expectations above what they were, say 30 years ago. Even Safeway sells better produce than they did when I lived her in the 90s.

WF in DC has been a mixed bag. I've gotten sick from the prepared stuff and avoid anything that looks like repackaged leftovers. The produce mostly comes from a lot of the same suppliers as Giant and Safeway and that's been true for 15-20 years, if not longer. It's the rapid turnover and better care of the stuff that makes it worth buying at WF. Utilitarian stuff like onions and garlic often are better at Giant. Some things like herbs are local and summer vegetables do come from this region, but Giant does that, too. The baked goods have always been uneven--I'm more impressed with Wegman's which seems to have better seasonal produce.

My own take is that WF never lived up to its hype and there has been change but hasn't exactly been radical. The activist investors seemed particularly interested in reducing rent costs. They wanted to close the stores in NYC (which don't seem to have changed much), apparently not taking into consideration the enormous volumes they did or that they had largely killed off what was left of Food Emporium and had a big chunk of the market to themselves outside of some local one-shots like Zabar's. It's also not as though they had a big choice of places with large commercial spaces. Like most activist shareholders they were idiots and probably ahd other dumb ideas. The original owner soured labor relations when he spoke out against Obamacare which coincided with people also were getting their hours cut (although Obamacare was still a ways away from actual imprlementation). There seem to be people who disappeared after Bezos took over, but still a great many long-timers at my usual store. They're still opening new stores in this area and they recently re-opened a store that was closed for years because of landlord problems related to recurring vermin issues.

[storewanderer]

Whole Foods just restructured its regions and CA is now its own Region. OR/WA/ID/NV/AZ/CO/TX and a ton of other states are part of some Pacific West region or something.

Whole Foods used to do a lot better with seasonal produce variety having the fun items like the numerous pluot/apricot varieties and fun crosses like peach-nectarine cross, but the past couple years their variety is very basic and boring. They have the very minimum basics (white/yellow nectarines/peaches and yellow apricots) in conventional and Organic but forget any fun surprises. I do notice they still throw some fun surprises into the berry case like the golden strawberries or the "Sweetest Bunch" bigger/sweeter raspberries/blackberries (beyond appearances these are just as inconsistent as any others are).

Whole Foods NorCal still has some variances between stores on prepared foods/bakery/deli items due to store size. Some stores do different prep than others.

For instance one store I know of has what I think is the "standard" pizza program- it has a giant expensive oven, flour coated extra thin crust, stingy on the ingredients, often dried out and lukewarm pizza. Dough is made fresh daily (based on the quality, not sure what they are accomplishing). This was acceptable when it was 2.50 a slice, they'd reheat it, and with an extra cup of sauce, but at 3.99 a slice and a slice of attitude when you ask for it to be reheated, it is a hard pass. What is funny is Wild Oats pizza was very similar to this model of Whole Foods pizza but the different was Wild Oats used a lot more cheese, almost to the point the thickness of the cheese was the same as the thickness of the crust. This did survive the heat lamp better without drying out.

A second store is a lot smaller and the pizza program there was different. This store has a completely different pizza oven and makes pizzas that remind me more of Pizza Hut or something; thicker crust (not too thick), more sauce/cheese, and the area was self serve but more recently was converted to full serve for some reason. Same pricing as the other store but the slices are smaller in size but probably weigh about the same due to the greater amount of crust/sauce.

I've had my share of bland and my share of surprisingly great prepared food at Whole Foods. I rarely felt any of it was with the price/venue though. Wegman's stuff is at another level on taste, similar price (plus Wegman's gives you a nicer space to eat the food in). Hy Vee prepared food is a lot cheaper, has a similar mixed result (some bland some great), with a nicer space to eat it in. Many customers think Whole Foods prepared food uses the store ingredients but that is not the case, the prepared food orders from a restaurant supplier and is the same old stuff other restaurants use.