Pavilions?

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BreakingThrough
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Re: Pavilions?

Post by BreakingThrough »

klkla wrote: September 12th, 2020, 12:09 pm A lot of stores developed by Vons in the 1985-90 period were intended to be Pavilions but then two things happened that changed the plan.
Interesting. I grew up in the La Costa area and I remember when the La Costa Vons (El Camino Real & Aviara Pkwy) opened in the early '90s, it was an absolute REVELATION. The town was buzzing about the Panda Express (inside the store!! So convenient and unheard-of at the time), big bakery that used to give free cookies to kids each visit, huge clean store, etc.

It really felt like a "modern," upscale supermarket. It effectively replaced an older and much smaller Vons in La Costa (at El Camino Real & La Costa Ave.). Compared to the older Vons, it was night and day! Really felt like a different banner entirely, and I think it would have been successful if it launched as Pavilions. (BTW the "old" Vons hung on for years after the "big" new Vons opened. That space is now an Equinox gym.) I think it would actually still be successful as a Pavilions today if they zhuzhed up the perimeter offerings. Pretty sure they still have the Panda Express!

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Re: Pavilions?

Post by retailfanmitchell019 »

BreakingThrough wrote: September 17th, 2020, 3:44 pm
Interesting. I grew up in the La Costa area and I remember when the La Costa Vons (El Camino Real & Aviara Pkwy) opened in the early '90s, it was an absolute REVELATION. The town was buzzing about the Panda Express (inside the store!! So convenient and unheard-of at the time), big bakery that used to give free cookies to kids each visit, huge clean store, etc.

It really felt like a "modern," upscale supermarket. It effectively replaced an older and much smaller Vons in La Costa (at El Camino Real & La Costa Ave.). Compared to the older Vons, it was night and day! Really felt like a different banner entirely, and I think it would have been successful if it launched as Pavilions. (BTW the "old" Vons hung on for years after the "big" new Vons opened. That space is now an Equinox gym.) I think it would actually still be successful as a Pavilions today if they zhuzhed up the perimeter offerings. Pretty sure they still have the Panda Express!
Albertsons opened a very nice store in La Costa (NE corner of La Costa and El Camino) in March 2004. It was going to open in October 2003, but it was delayed by the strike. Lucky was going to build on that lot, but planning of the store was delayed before.
This store had a Jewel interior like this:
This store has the layout of a Lucky/Sav-on. Unfortunately, Supervalu remodeled this in 2012 and Albertsons then sold it to Haggen (the first Haggen to open in SoCal).

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Re: Pavilions?

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retailfanmitchell019 wrote: September 17th, 2020, 4:02 pm Albertsons opened a very nice store in La Costa (NE corner of La Costa and El Camino) in March 2004. It was going to open in October 2003, but it was delayed by the strike. Lucky was going to build on that lot, but planning of the store was delayed before.
This store had a Jewel interior like this:
This store has the layout of a Lucky/Sav-on. Unfortunately, Supervalu remodeled this in 2012 and Albertsons then sold it to Haggen (the first Haggen to open in SoCal).
Yes, in fact, before it closed that was the nicest Albertsons I had ever seen. After the Haggen debacle it is now a Gelson's, but apparently struggling. It was one of the locations they quickly opened as a Gelsons and later remodeled / downsized. Still Gelson's, but still doesn't feel like a "real" newer Gelson's, like Manhattan Beach, which was built as Gelson's from the beginning. Maybe that's why it's struggling.

The older La Costa Vons (now Equinox) I mentioned in my previous post is directly across the street, on the SE corner of La Costa and El Camino.

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Re: Pavilions?

Post by klkla »

BreakingThrough wrote: September 17th, 2020, 4:11 pmAfter the Haggen debacle it is now a Gelson's, but apparently struggling. It was one of the locations they quickly opened as a Gelsons and later remodeled / downsized. Still Gelson's, but still doesn't feel like a "real" newer Gelson's, like Manhattan Beach, which was built as Gelson's from the beginning. Maybe that's why it's struggling.
Both of the Gelson's in North County are 'second best' locations on the fringe of the only community that would really work for them (Rancho Santa Fe). In a perfect world Gelson's would be in the location that Vons is at on Lomas Santa Fe Drive in Solana Beach.

As for San Diego in general the other two communities that would work for them are La Jolla and Hillcrest. They had locations in both neighborhoods that were former Mayfair Markets and gave them up. Hillcrest is now a RiteAid and La Jolla is a CVS.

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Re: Pavilions?

Post by storewanderer »

klkla wrote: September 17th, 2020, 7:45 pm
As for San Diego in general the other two communities that would work for them are La Jolla and Hillcrest. They had locations in both neighborhoods that were former Mayfair Markets and gave them up. Hillcrest is now a RiteAid and La Jolla is a CVS.
I think the very small Pacific Beach Store is working okay for Gelson's. Nicely remodeled too. Very small store though.

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Re: Pavilions?

Post by retailfanmitchell019 »

storewanderer wrote: September 17th, 2020, 11:07 pm
I think the very small Pacific Beach Store is working okay for Gelson's. Nicely remodeled too. Very small store though.
Yeah, it's a former Alpha Beta

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Re: Pavilions?

Post by retailfanmitchell019 »

klkla wrote: September 17th, 2020, 7:45 pm
BreakingThrough wrote: September 17th, 2020, 4:11 pmAfter the Haggen debacle it is now a Gelson's, but apparently struggling. It was one of the locations they quickly opened as a Gelsons and later remodeled / downsized. Still Gelson's, but still doesn't feel like a "real" newer Gelson's, like Manhattan Beach, which was built as Gelson's from the beginning. Maybe that's why it's struggling.
Both of the Gelson's in North County are 'second best' locations on the fringe of the only community that would really work for them (Rancho Santa Fe). In a perfect world Gelson's would be in the location that Vons is at on Lomas Santa Fe Drive in Solana Beach.

As for San Diego in general the other two communities that would work for them are La Jolla and Hillcrest. They had locations in both neighborhoods that were former Mayfair Markets and gave them up. Hillcrest is now a RiteAid and La Jolla is a CVS.
Gelson's hasn't downsized their Del Mar store, but they gave it a very nice remodel. Albertsons bought this store from Big Bear in 1994 and remodeled it into Jewel interior around 2003 (similar to La Costa), then Supervalu dumbed it down, giving it "paint and cardboard" interior (PF&H 3.0) in 2012. Haggen bought this store in 2015.
This Albertsons was far nicer than the Solana Beach Vons, which had Lifestyle 1.0. Del Mar was a very profitable store.

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Re: Pavilions?

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storewanderer wrote: September 13th, 2020, 12:08 am
rwsandiego wrote: September 12th, 2020, 8:40 pm
It feels unlikely that this store was planned to be a Pavilions.

I heard many years ago back on the old Yahoo Finance SWY or ABS message board that this store was built out to be a Pavilions then they didn't go through with it and it ended up being a Lucky. It is possible there is some confusion but I think the source of that information was a long term employee.

I wonder if during that 18 months it was sitting vacant, it was being finished as a Pavilions then when they bolted Lucky opted to take it back.

Or if the old information I got about Pavilions was incorrect, it doesn't seem completely out of the question they built out a price impact "Advantage" store with no fresh departments. So, all of the wall spaces were built out, refrigerated, etc. Then to convert it to a normal Lucky they needed to add in bakery/deli/pharmacy. So they built bakery/deli into the middle of the store and threw pharmacy up in one of the front corners. The layout may have just so happened to be identical to a Pavilions.

There was an Albertsons in Culver City in a former Gemco and it had an odd layout but all of the service departments had wall spaces.
The now-closed (and now a new car dealership for multiple brands in the same Gemco built building) Albertsons in Culver City was reopened as a Lucky/Sav-on combination after being closed for years as a Gemco. The reason it had an odd layout was because of the combo. When CVS bought out Sav-on, they closed the free movement between the two stores (Albertsons retained the liquor license after the split and that was one of very few CVS locations that didn't sell any in CA).

The Culver City Lucky/Sav-on then Albertsons/CVS never did well. Biggest problem was it wasn't in an area with any residential and was somewhat difficult to get into.

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Re: Pavilions?

Post by storewanderer »

CalItalian wrote: September 19th, 2020, 11:00 am The now-closed (and now a new car dealership for multiple brands in the same Gemco built building) Albertsons in Culver City was reopened as a Lucky/Sav-on combination after being closed for years as a Gemco. The reason it had an odd layout was because of the combo. When CVS bought out Sav-on, they closed the free movement between the two stores (Albertsons retained the liquor license after the split and that was one of very few CVS locations that didn't sell any in CA).

The Culver City Lucky/Sav-on then Albertsons/CVS never did well. Biggest problem was it wasn't in an area with any residential and was somewhat difficult to get into.
I wonder why that store was a combo with separate Lucky/Sav-On vs. a combo with both stores together...? Did it predate when they did the "together" combo stores in CA (which I think came after they took some Smiths Stores over)?

There were some odd old Skaggs/Albertsons combos in Colorado a few of which hung around into the LLC years. It was literally a single entry then walk one direction for Albertsons (typically a run down Grocery Warehouse/Max Store) and walk the other direction for Rite Aid (typically a store that still had an early 90's Osco interior). Once inside the store, the two stores were separated by shelving units. No clue how they handled the back rooms. The last of those stores finally went away when LLC was closing stores in 2008 but a few Rite Aids hung around a bit longer.

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Re: Pavilions?

Post by veteran+ »

storewanderer wrote: September 20th, 2020, 12:39 am
CalItalian wrote: September 19th, 2020, 11:00 am The now-closed (and now a new car dealership for multiple brands in the same Gemco built building) Albertsons in Culver City was reopened as a Lucky/Sav-on combination after being closed for years as a Gemco. The reason it had an odd layout was because of the combo. When CVS bought out Sav-on, they closed the free movement between the two stores (Albertsons retained the liquor license after the split and that was one of very few CVS locations that didn't sell any in CA).

The Culver City Lucky/Sav-on then Albertsons/CVS never did well. Biggest problem was it wasn't in an area with any residential and was somewhat difficult to get into.
I wonder why that store was a combo with separate Lucky/Sav-On vs. a combo with both stores together...? Did it predate when they did the "together" combo stores in CA (which I think came after they took some Smiths Stores over)?

There were some odd old Skaggs/Albertsons combos in Colorado a few of which hung around into the LLC years. It was literally a single entry then walk one direction for Albertsons (typically a run down Grocery Warehouse/Max Store) and walk the other direction for Rite Aid (typically a store that still had an early 90's Osco interior). Once inside the store, the two stores were separated by shelving units. No clue how they handled the back rooms. The last of those stores finally went away when LLC was closing stores in 2008 but a few Rite Aids hung around a bit longer.
In "their day" those Skaggs/Albertsons Combo stores were palaces. I remember seeing them and just......WOW! And the employees were just as impressive!

I miss Joe Albertson!

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