Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by veteran+ »

Pandemic aside, Target always made clear that these different size formats were a work in progress to address myriad type markets from city to college to real estate and competitive issues.

Perhaps the waters are muddied at present.

I would have preferred for them to perfect the "Super" format along with locations better suited for their Brand (Targets in Walmart type demographics don't work that well.).

The last Super Target I was in was in Indio (Coachella Valley Ca.). WRONG neighborhood right next to a busy Winco. You just can't get it more wrong than that.

Gorgeous Super Target in the wrong place.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by storewanderer »

veteran+ wrote: April 5th, 2021, 5:27 am I would have preferred for them to perfect the "Super" format along with locations better suited for their Brand (Targets in Walmart type demographics don't work that well.).

The last Super Target I was in was in Indio (Coachella Valley Ca.). WRONG neighborhood right next to a busy Winco. You just can't get it more wrong than that.

Gorgeous Super Target in the wrong place.
You can get it more wrong- Super Target in Atwater, CA shares a parking lot with a Wal Mart Supercenter. Really poor fresh departments at that Super Target. Physically, a very nice store. That was one of the last Super Targets to open.

Target should have been a leader in fresh groceries. The first Super Targets opened in the 90's had the bakery, deli, and meat employees walking around in chef uniforms complete with the hat. Maybe that was a bit much, but now it has swung too far in the other direction.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by Romr123 »

They "desupered" that LaQuinta Target...all 3 in the Coachella Valley are pFresh.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by buckguy »

Super Target and the watered down versions they have in non "Super" stores were forced on them by Wall Street. Much like Walmart and its small stores, they've really not had their heart in it, particularly the "Super" format. The watered down versions actually seem smarter and work more to their strengths---more upscale and/or niche brands, very limited perishables (which normally aren't very good), and often large beer/wine sections. The perishable prices are unremarkable, but everything else is usually cheaper than regular chains. The problem is that food has higher labor and equipment demands than most of their other merchandise and is less profitable. Their model being profitability over volume, the expanded food selections never made sense.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by TW-Upstate NY »

storewanderer wrote: April 6th, 2021, 12:03 am You can get it more wrong- Super Target in Atwater, CA shares a parking lot with a Wal Mart Supercenter.
Same thing in Dickson City, Pa. (just outside Scranton) although not a Super Target.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by babs »

buckguy wrote: April 6th, 2021, 5:01 am Super Target and the watered down versions they have in non "Super" stores were forced on them by Wall Street. Much like Walmart and its small stores, they've really not had their heart in it, particularly the "Super" format. The watered down versions actually seem smarter and work more to their strengths---more upscale and/or niche brands, very limited perishables (which normally aren't very good), and often large beer/wine sections. The perishable prices are unremarkable, but everything else is usually cheaper than regular chains. The problem is that food has higher labor and equipment demands than most of their other merchandise and is less profitable. Their model being profitability over volume, the expanded food selections never made sense.
Neither Target nor Walmart do perishables well. Both chains have awful produce, meat and bakery offerings. You may pick some of this stuff up as a convenience but no one is going to either store because of their amazing produce and meat. It's price and convenience.

Having said that, I love the way food is presented at the Target attached to the corporate office in Minneapolis. If that presentation was at the entry to all Targets, they would sell a lot more food.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by klkla »

FWIW a few of the small 20,000 sq ft Targets I have been to here in LA all seem pretty busy. People think of them more like a big 7-11 than a traditional Target. They have a lot of convenience grocery items and get a lot of impulse buys on their limited but profitable GM offerings.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by storewanderer »

babs wrote: April 6th, 2021, 10:54 am
Neither Target nor Walmart do perishables well. Both chains have awful produce, meat and bakery offerings. You may pick some of this stuff up as a convenience but no one is going to either store because of their amazing produce and meat. It's price and convenience.

Having said that, I love the way food is presented at the Target attached to the corporate office in Minneapolis. If that presentation was at the entry to all Targets, they would sell a lot more food.
Wal Mart's produce seems to vary by store. Some locations it looks better than other locations. They aren't real consistent. In my area Wal Mart has a larger produce variety than Smiths or Save Mart, for instance, including fairly extensive Asian and other specialty vegetables that Smiths and Save Mart don't handle- but freshness is an issue often times. Target's produce is routinely awful looking at every store. Even in the Super Targets it is overpriced and not rotated well and has a poor mix of items. In some stores where Target seems to actually sell some amount of produce they don't seem to bother to refill the displays throughout the day so they are empty or near empty by mid-afternoon.

Wal Mart's meat program also is not really much worse than a standard conventional grocer for basic cuts of meat. Wal Mart (Smiths too) at least sells Ground Round and Ground Sirloin but you have to hunt for it among the display of mostly ground beef, unlike most major grocers including Whole Foods who just sell "ground beef." That "ground beef" can include pink slime but if it is labeled as Ground Sirloin or Ground Round then it cannot include that per USDA Guidelines. Target of course labels as ground beef what little product they have. Wal Mart over the years has really worked hard to make its prepackaged meat look similar to meat that is packaged in store at other grocers. The packages look similar now and the quality of the cuts is not really any worse. I am not sure how much of this is Wal Mart getting better and the conventional grocers getting worse... Also, Wal Mart's policy is to mark products down the day before the sell by date then mark down a second time on the sell by date, and as a result their meat cases typically look quite fresh. Much of their meat is USDA Choice as well. Target's meat just looks awful, overpackaged in big plastic tubs full of air and an absolutely pathetic display. Beef routinely an off color. I have bought raw chicken at Target (Foster Farms label same as any other store with it) on markdown in the past but that is it. I also notice sometimes at Target there is meat expiring that same day that does not look fresh and is not marked down.

As far as bakery goes Wal Mart's Marketside Bakery Items are not bad. I have tried many items- I would put various of what I've tried in the Marketside line including mini cream pies, cupcakes, lemon bars, croissants, cinnamon rolls, mini carrot cake, cookies, up against what any of the conventional stores offer, they are mostly better quality. I wasn't too thrilled with the Marketside muffins or loaf cake (same provider- Product of Canada). They are also priced similarly. They also have quite a large variety. Their other items (not marked Marketside) are pretty horrible, definitely below a normal conventional. Italian/French Bread is okay, Sourdough inedible. But Target's bakery is even worse in the Super Targets. They have a very limited mix of items, very few items made in store but they do have a few store made items, and very very high prices. Target may as well pull bakery out entirely and just refer interested customers to the Starbucks department, it is that bad.

This is where Target loses it- they get a nice looking presentation of food in a store that has nearly unlimited resources and labor and have a complete disconnect from the reality of what the typical Target Store is like or how the typical Target Store is executing. It is like this for many chains when you go into a store near the HQ and it is always disappointing to return home and see how inferior the stores are.

The last Target remodel done in my area in 2019 in Carson City was a non P-Fresh Store and the remodel added in NO fresh groceries at all. Didn't even add any refrigeration beyond the 30 or so feet of it against the front wall. 1995 configuration lives on. The nearest grocery store is a lousy Save Mart about 8 minutes away (though there is a Costco, Wal mart, and Trader Joe's about 3 minutes away).

Wal Mart 's main Supercenter closest to their HQ in Bentonville doesn't look any different than a typical Wal Mart Supercenter in a rural location with a middle class customer base. It isn't perfect, but it is moving merchandise. Nothing special.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by veteran+ »

Since I will Never step foot in a Walmart, No matter what, I will defer to your experiences of improvements.

My experiences at Target (all sizes) have been more positive than negative in all areas that I have visited.

Perhaps your views on Target are more representative since your are more travelled.
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Re: Target Closing 2 Small Stores in the San Francisco Bay Area

Post by SamSpade »

Portland's downtown Target relocation to the first floor is almost complete. Local media are starting to report the change. Babs had previously mentioned this. Obviously it will be one of these "new" stores as leasing only the first floor of the building will even further shrink their footprint. I believe they had a stock room on the first floor along with the freight elevators necessary to reach 2nd and 3rd floors and a large entryway to the guest elevator bays that went from level 1 to level 2. This will all now be unnecessary.
Target will shrink downtown store
The reporter did not note the new store's square footage. I will say for 89,000 square feet before, it always felt limited from a customer perspective.
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