Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

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Re: Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

Post by Knight » August 10th, 2016, 6:03 am

lake wrote: The thing is who has succeeded against Publix? Even stores that are generally able to take some off the edges of conventional grocers (Whole Foods, Walmart, etc) have had great troubles in Florida. Publix is the grocery store in Florida and that is not changing unless their operations significantly decline.
The list of participants who has succeeded against Publix is very short when compared to those who have failed against it (i.e. Bi-Lo, Food Lion, Harris Teeter, Piggly Wiggly, Sweetbay, Winn-Dixie). Publix may have several older stores in operation in Florida, but those stores are higher volume stores compared to newer, struggling Winn-Dixie stores.
lake wrote:Although it is possible for Safeway to find a few small niches and fill them, dominating large parts of Florida is going to be impossible no matter how much money they dump into it. Generally, I believe Safeway is aware of this and I honestly believe the notion that they are using these stores to test new ideas before shipping them elsewhere. They have stores that despite poor Albertsons operations stayed high volume and are likely profitable, yet if they mess them up there's really no harm done. Acquiring WinnDixie seems like a trap Safeway would not be willing to fall into. Florida is an impossible case to crack, and acquiring hundreds of low volume, rundown, old stores in bad locations is not the way to do it.
Hundreds of low volume, rundown, old stores in bad locations could be reasons why Winn-Dixie has not been acquired.

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Re: Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

Post by pseudo3d » August 10th, 2016, 6:34 am

Albertsons is not going to buy Winn-Dixie whole (though with the apparent Albertsons Monopoly mentions of Pathmark/A&P/Superfresh, they seemed to come to close to buying A&P), though in the case of Albertsons Florida, they might take a few of the nicer stores (and who knows? Maybe Harris Teeter will be interested too).
lake wrote: The thing is who has succeeded against Publix? Even stores that are generally able to take some off the edges of conventional grocers (Whole Foods, Walmart, etc) have had great troubles in Florida. Publix is the grocery store in Florida and that is not changing unless their operations significantly decline. Although it is possible for Safeway to find a few small niches and fill them, dominating large parts of Florida is going to be impossible no matter how much money they dump into it. Generally, I believe Safeway is aware of this and I honestly believe the notion that they are using these stores to test new ideas before shipping them elsewhere. They have stores that despite poor Albertsons operations stayed high volume and are likely profitable, yet if they mess them up there's really no harm done. Acquiring WinnDixie seems like a trap Safeway would not be willing to fall into. Florida is an impossible case to crack, and acquiring hundreds of low volume, rundown, old stores in bad locations is not the way to do it.
There isn't going to be a domination over Publix from Safeway, no question. If I recall, the Albertsons Florida operation numbered nearly 100 stores by the mid-2000s, most were profitable (the "Publix 49" were), they had a presence in most markets (except notably the Miami core and Lakeland), and yet Publix still outnumbered them 7 to 1. Of the 35+ years Albertsons was in Florida (post-Skaggs), only for 20 years they actually had a distribution center, and it was never contiguous with other Albertsons stores even in the best of times.

That doesn't mean that the Safeway conversions are going to be a failure. Are they unsustainable at the current set-up? Yes. Is it a risky business move? Yes. But I'm willing to give it a chance.

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Re: Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

Post by lake » August 10th, 2016, 8:06 am

pseudo3d wrote:
If I recall, the Albertsons Florida operation numbered nearly 100 stores by the mid-2000s, most were profitable (the "Publix 49" were), they had a presence in most markets (except notably the Miami core and Lakeland), and yet Publix still outnumbered them 7 to 1. Of the 35+ years Albertsons was in Florida (post-Skaggs), only for 20 years they actually had a distribution center, and it was never contiguous with other Albertsons stores even in the best of times.
Albertsons spent years, and I mean years making those stores profitable. Even with their profitability, most stuck to Publix and didn't even step foot in a Albertsons store. Publix is also much larger and more dominant than when Albertsons first attempted. Opening a new store in Florida and expecting people to just come is hopeless, even if it's a store that worked previously. People like Publix, and people aren't going to leave Publix.

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Re: Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

Post by pseudo3d » August 10th, 2016, 10:37 am

lake wrote:
pseudo3d wrote:
If I recall, the Albertsons Florida operation numbered nearly 100 stores by the mid-2000s, most were profitable (the "Publix 49" were), they had a presence in most markets (except notably the Miami core and Lakeland), and yet Publix still outnumbered them 7 to 1. Of the 35+ years Albertsons was in Florida (post-Skaggs), only for 20 years they actually had a distribution center, and it was never contiguous with other Albertsons stores even in the best of times.
Albertsons spent years, and I mean years making those stores profitable. Even with their profitability, most stuck to Publix and didn't even step foot in a Albertsons store. Publix is also much larger and more dominant than when Albertsons first attempted. Opening a new store in Florida and expecting people to just come is hopeless, even if it's a store that worked previously. People like Publix, and people aren't going to leave Publix.
That is true...I remember my cousin (he grew up in Altamonte Springs) explaining how Publix was superior, even turning his wife (who grew up in Texas with nice H-E-B stores) into a Publix preferrer. When asked about the Altamonte Springs Albertsons, he explained how he never really liked it as much as Publix growing up. But as many true Publix fans there are, there are probably just as many who go to Publix by necessity/preference over inferior competitors (Walmart and Winn-Dixie) and not because they genuinely love it. That (and the "I'll go anywhere but Publix" crowd) are the ones Albertsons will have to attract, and I think that's a viable market.

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Re: Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

Post by cjd » February 4th, 2020, 8:24 pm

Interestingly, Winn Dixie still seems to be using this decor style in their current remodels. They have improved some a bit with warehouse ceilings and wood floors in the produce department. They seem to have been spending a bit more on them lately with new flooring, lighting and refrigeration which were often missing in some stores that got this remodel.

W-D never was able to pull off a successful store-wide remodel campaign post bankruptcy.

They came out of bankruptcy in 2006 and have essentially had 3-4 decors since:

First was the very first remodels that started around late 2008-ish. These were quite nice, thorough remodels with new refrigeration, fixtures, flooring, including wood flooring in some departments and expanded departments. Also relocated the entrance from the front left corner to the front opening directly into produce, which really made a better first impression.

Supposedly about half the chain was able to get this remodel before it ended, although some of the later ones were cheapened a bit, especially in 90s Marketplace era stores that kept their original floors and fixtures instead of getting new ones.

Then came the Transformational remodels a few years later. These are very nice stores and got all new decor and rearranging of departments. Wood and concrete floors, warehouse ceilings, and stainless steel or black refrigeration. Larger deli and bakery with items like made to order pizzas, larger sandwich stations, wing bars, etc. Cheese steward and large fish counter, etc. Some of these were new builds (I believe mainly in AL though) the new W-D in FL with this decor were usually former Publix stores that W-D heavily remodeled. Unfortunately I think the price was just too high to do many of these and it was obviously it would never work for most or all of the chain. Quickly after the sale to Bi-Lo these remodels slowed and stopped.

After the Bi-Lo sale they went back to remodels that were like the 2008+ ones but incorporated more of the transformational features, and a more modern decor, mostly green and black. Although simple, the decor in these stores looks upscale, with the wood floors and black refrigeration.

Then the current red decor came out, around 2016, which like I said has been modified a bit to seem more upscale in some stores.

There are a few stores that got a similar decor to this, but are more like the transformational arrangement, such as the Hyde Park store, but they were far too expensive to be on a wide scale, and I don't think they still use this format in any current remodels.

Of course there are also the stores Winn Dixie gained from the Sweetbay buyout in 2012. Most of these retained the original Sweetbay decor with minor changes and some slight updating, but some have since been remodeled to the current red W-D decor. Many of Sweetbays stores were more modern anyway, since Kash N Karry had remodeled to the Sweetbay banner during 2004-06, and new Sweetbays were being built almost right to the time of the sale to W-D in 2012.

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Re: Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

Post by wnetmacman » February 10th, 2020, 11:52 pm

cjd wrote:
February 4th, 2020, 8:24 pm
W-D never was able to pull off a successful store-wide remodel campaign post bankruptcy.
They weren't really good at getting to every store pre-bankruptcy either. They never really got the full Marketplace decor to every store.
cjd wrote:
February 4th, 2020, 8:24 pm
First was the very first remodels that started around late 2008-ish. These were quite nice, thorough remodels with new refrigeration, fixtures, flooring, including wood flooring in some departments and expanded departments. Also relocated the entrance from the front left corner to the front opening directly into produce, which really made a better first impression.

Supposedly about half the chain was able to get this remodel before it ended, although some of the later ones were cheapened a bit, especially in 90s Marketplace era stores that kept their original floors and fixtures instead of getting new ones.
I know many of the Louisiana stores didn't get this decor. Only one west of the Mississippi did, and that's gone now.
cjd wrote:
February 4th, 2020, 8:24 pm
Then came the Transformational remodels a few years later. These are very nice stores and got all new decor and rearranging of departments. Wood and concrete floors, warehouse ceilings, and stainless steel or black refrigeration. Larger deli and bakery with items like made to order pizzas, larger sandwich stations, wing bars, etc. Cheese steward and large fish counter, etc. Some of these were new builds (I believe mainly in AL though) the new W-D in FL with this decor were usually former Publix stores that W-D heavily remodeled. Unfortunately I think the price was just too high to do many of these and it was obviously it would never work for most or all of the chain. Quickly after the sale to Bi-Lo these remodels slowed and stopped.
There were only two new builds in Louisiana; Covington and New Orleans. No other stores got this level of attention here.

Apparently, Louisiana has become as a whole what the western part of the chain here did in its last few years; the red-headed stepchild. Remodels are few and far between, and where they are happening are extremely high volume stores with a possible future.

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Re: Winn-Dixie Reveals Next generation Store

Post by cjd » February 12th, 2020, 6:54 pm

wnetmacman wrote:
February 10th, 2020, 11:52 pm
They weren't really good at getting to every store pre-bankruptcy either. They never really got the full Marketplace decor to every store.

I know many of the Louisiana stores didn't get this decor. Only one west of the Mississippi did, and that's gone now.


There were only two new builds in Louisiana; Covington and New Orleans. No other stores got this level of attention here.
Those are the two I was thinking of, I don't think any of the Transformational stores were actually in AL like I had said. I think it was mostly just FL and LA. I think they really tried to push and make a big deal of these stores out to be more than they were. They really are nice stores, but it's like when JCP or Macy's tries to open a new flagship store, and act as if it will change people's perception of the entire chain - sure that store itself is nice, but it does nothing for the other 99% that haven't and won't ever be at that level of a store.

Most of the red remodels here have been to stores that were obtained from the Sweetbay buyout, and have been pretty simplistic. Although like I said these stores were already pretty modern when W-D got them. Still it's nice to see them try to push forward with them when so many other retailers gave up.

In my area, W-D did a pretty major expansion into central FL around 1973-77, and most of these stores were replaced in the early to mid 90s with Marketplace stores. I don't think many of the 70s stores ever got any updating, the one we shopped at in the early 90s as a kid had 70s looking decor from what I recall. I actually know of one of those 70s stores just south of me that got replaced very early on in 1985 with a new store in the same strip mall. Not sure why. In my town the original store from the 70s was kept and operated along with an early 80s store until around 2000 when the original one closed. In that case the 70s store actually did get a decor update in the 80s. The other store got a very simplistic redo in the early 2000s and then another more thorough one in 2008. Since the Sweetbay buyout once again there are two W-Ds here.

In many towns they have simply replaced the 90s era Marketplace store with the more up to date Sweetbay instead of keeping both. Some towns simply were not large enough to operate two stores, and there were also trade issues especially if the only other stores in town were Walmart and Save A Lot, since Publix typically didn't build in small towns, although that has actually been changing these last few years.

The Marketplace style stores stopped at the end of the 90s/very early 2000s. After that W-D was still opening stores right up to the bankruptcy in 2005, but it was very few and they had a totally different decor that was a bit fancier than the Marketplace one as well as a completely different layout.

Any remodels done in the early 2000s were mainly done to stores that were built prior to the Marketplace era, mostly early-mid 80s stores around here, since the 70s ones were all gone by then. These remodels were typically very simplistic, basically just a repaint and some new decor. There were a few instances where they did more and added new flooring, all new refrigeration, displays and checkout aisles, but it seemed to be pretty uncommon. I only know of one existing store to get the fancier decor they were using in the new builds of the time and it was a 90s Marketplace store that was damaged in a hurricane. Probably the very last store to reopen in 2005 until W-D started opening new stores again in the late 2000s.

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