What about Shaw's?

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pseudo3d
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What about Shaw's?

Post by pseudo3d » August 26th, 2016, 9:17 am

For all of its significant operational and pricing problems, it seems that every division at Albertsons has something to celebrate, whether it's new stores, remodeled stores, or team sponsorships (often all three). The only one that seems to be pretty quiet lately is Shaw's/Star Market with no new store announcements, no renovation news, or really anything save for a food donation sponsorship. It faces competition from Stop & Shop in Boston and Hannaford up north, which will only get stronger as Ahold Delhaize begins to unify its chains, and it seemed to have suffered a lot of damage under SuperValu, while not bouncing back like ACME did.

I could be wrong about this, but is it possible Albertsons is keeping it in a holding pattern because they are considering selling it? It's in a state where they've maintained it well enough so that it's not totally worthless and could stand up on its own, and once things get better in the rest of the chain, they could even buy it back.

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by BillyGr » August 26th, 2016, 10:06 am

Good question. They did close the Connecticut stores a few years back (but then Acme picked up a few A&P locations in the part of CT closest to NY recently).

Some of their (outlying) areas have to be fairly decent, just due to lack of competition (thinking of at least VT, for instance Wilmington with no other market without driving to Bennington or Brattleboro and I'd suspect other former Grand Unions they bought in smaller areas).
Even the competitive areas are there many options? One would think they'd do OK with just one other chain (like the Hannaford or Stop & Shop) in the area, which is probably the case in many areas?

Could it also be that they figure what they have in these areas is OK for the areas and are just choosing to spend in the other divisions where there is more of a competition (and also like with Acme a lot of newly acquired stores that probably weren't the best maintained for a number of years due to former owners financial issues)?

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by pseudo3d » August 26th, 2016, 12:07 pm

BillyGr wrote:Good question. They did close the Connecticut stores a few years back (but then Acme picked up a few A&P locations in the part of CT closest to NY recently).

Some of their (outlying) areas have to be fairly decent, just due to lack of competition (thinking of at least VT, for instance Wilmington with no other market without driving to Bennington or Brattleboro and I'd suspect other former Grand Unions they bought in smaller areas).
Even the competitive areas are there many options? One would think they'd do OK with just one other chain (like the Hannaford or Stop & Shop) in the area, which is probably the case in many areas?

Could it also be that they figure what they have in these areas is OK for the areas and are just choosing to spend in the other divisions where there is more of a competition (and also like with Acme a lot of newly acquired stores that probably weren't the best maintained for a number of years due to former owners financial issues)?
A majority of the A&P/Pathmark stores acquired were remodeled, some to the "A&P Fresh" prototype, and it was more of the operational types A&P was failing at. Jewel-Osco got perhaps the most capex, but there's not a whole lot of competition in the Chicago market (at least in the traditional sense, as averaging the last 5 years, Dominick's was going down in flames and Mariano's was still small).

The fact that some of these Shaw's stores have little competition seems like it could be a plus for selling as a whole rather than in parts (in comparison, the Denver and Houston divisions wouldn't hack it between Safeway's poor stewardship and rough competition). I'm not necessarily in favor of selling Shaw's, but I do think it could be a possibility, and it would look a whole lot better on the books than mass closures.

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by rwsandiego » September 3rd, 2016, 9:36 am

This is pure speculation, but I'm wondering whether the new Albertsons is focusing on one or two chains at a time. Here in SoCal, we are seeing very few remodels at VONS, including at Lifestyle 1.0 stores that were last touched in 2006/2007. However, ACME seems to be getting quite a bit of attention as has Jewel, where stores that were remodeled a few years ago are getting remodeled again. Perhaps they are determining whether the Shaw's or Star name should survive and then will remodel as they re-brand?

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by wnetmacman » September 3rd, 2016, 11:25 am

rwsandiego wrote:This is pure speculation, but I'm wondering whether the new Albertsons is focusing on one or two chains at a time. Here in SoCal, we are seeing very few remodels at VONS, including at Lifestyle 1.0 stores that were last touched in 2006/2007. However, ACME seems to be getting quite a bit of attention as has Jewel, where stores that were remodeled a few years ago are getting remodeled again. Perhaps they are determining whether the Shaw's or Star name should survive and then will remodel as they re-brand?
I would suspect that Jewel and Acme have become the cash cows. Therefore, they get more attention and investment. Many of the LLC stores also have been cleaned up recently.

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by rwsandiego » September 3rd, 2016, 6:22 pm

wnetmacman wrote:
rwsandiego wrote:This is pure speculation, but I'm wondering whether the new Albertsons is focusing on one or two chains at a time. Here in SoCal, we are seeing very few remodels at VONS, including at Lifestyle 1.0 stores that were last touched in 2006/2007. However, ACME seems to be getting quite a bit of attention as has Jewel, where stores that were remodeled a few years ago are getting remodeled again. Perhaps they are determining whether the Shaw's or Star name should survive and then will remodel as they re-brand?
I would suspect that Jewel and Acme have become the cash cows. Therefore, they get more attention and investment. Many of the LLC stores also have been cleaned up recently.
I think you are right. In fact, Jewel has been a cash cow dating back to the ASC days.

Based on pics in Yelp reviews, it seems Star Market has received more attention than Shaw's.

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by architect » September 4th, 2016, 10:06 pm

rwsandiego wrote:This is pure speculation, but I'm wondering whether the new Albertsons is focusing on one or two chains at a time. Here in SoCal, we are seeing very few remodels at VONS, including at Lifestyle 1.0 stores that were last touched in 2006/2007. However, ACME seems to be getting quite a bit of attention as has Jewel, where stores that were remodeled a few years ago are getting remodeled again. Perhaps they are determining whether the Shaw's or Star name should survive and then will remodel as they re-brand?
Another big factor could be competition. In the Northeast, there are few competitors aside from Wegmans which are strong enough the put a dent in the performance of Shaws/Star Market. On the other hand, Albertsons is facing intense competition in other markets, compoetion which will limit them for years if not stemmed now. For example, Jewel is facing an increased competitive threat in the Chicagoland area due to Mariano's, while Kroger is hurting Albertsons with their Marketplace stores in Phoenix and DFW (DFW also has a looming HEB threat).

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by rwsandiego » September 4th, 2016, 11:41 pm

architect wrote:
rwsandiego wrote:This is pure speculation, but I'm wondering whether the new Albertsons is focusing on one or two chains at a time. Here in SoCal, we are seeing very few remodels at VONS, including at Lifestyle 1.0 stores that were last touched in 2006/2007. However, ACME seems to be getting quite a bit of attention as has Jewel, where stores that were remodeled a few years ago are getting remodeled again. Perhaps they are determining whether the Shaw's or Star name should survive and then will remodel as they re-brand?
Another big factor could be competition. In the Northeast, there are few competitors aside from Wegmans which are strong enough the put a dent in the performance of Shaws/Star Market. On the other hand, Albertsons is facing intense competition in other markets, compoetion which will limit them for years if not stemmed now. For example, Jewel is facing an increased competitive threat in the Chicagoland area due to Mariano's, while Kroger is hurting Albertsons with their Marketplace stores in Phoenix and DFW (DFW also has a looming HEB threat).
True. Acme has plenty of competition in their markets, so it makes perfect sense to remodel those stores.

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by storewanderer » September 4th, 2016, 11:46 pm

Acme seems to be the comeback kid. Being written off for years, it seems to have come back.

When I went to Acme, I did not think it was so bad. I was there when Safeway was closing Dominicks. To me, Acme seemed like a standard Albertsons. The stores were well stocked, clean, high priced, but did not seem staffed too well. They had some good specials (better than Supervalu was running out west at that time) and in general compared to A&P/Pathmark they were good. Compared to Giant-PA, they were really high priced. Acme at least had what appeared to be proper regional merchandising, unlike Genuardi's, which was merchandised in a California like manner.

Shaw's is a very distressed asset. I was in those stores and they are generally not doing much business; Hannaford seems to do a lot more business than Shaw's when the two compete nearby each other. Market Basket absolutely slaughters them. Curiously the Ahold brand that competes against them (Stop & Shop) seemed to be sort of weak (was nothing like Giant-PA) with high prices and pretty unappealing perimeters. I think a number of the Stop & Shops that competed against Shaw's have closed.

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Re: What about Shaw's?

Post by mbz321 » September 5th, 2016, 8:22 pm

storewanderer wrote:Acme seems to be the comeback kid. Being written off for years, it seems to have come back.

When I went to Acme, I did not think it was so bad. I was there when Safeway was closing Dominicks. To me, Acme seemed like a standard Albertsons. The stores were well stocked, clean, high priced, but did not seem staffed too well. They had some good specials (better than Supervalu was running out west at that time) and in general compared to A&P/Pathmark they were good. Compared to Giant-PA, they were really high priced. Acme at least had what appeared to be proper regional merchandising, unlike Genuardi's, which was merchandised in a California like manner.
Pricing is still a huge issue at Acme (as well as some other stupid decisions like removing Self-Checkouts which many customers became accustomed to). The weekly sales are pretty decent, but their regular pricing is still atrocious. I have seen things that are $1 or $2 less per item at Walmart, which has increased the number of Supercenters in Acme's operating area in the past several years. But I wouldn't even blame Walmart...as even Shoprite, Wegmans, and Giant's prices are generally lower, or with the case of ShopRite, offer more attractive loss leader sales. Going by several Yelp reviews for Acme's in former A&P's, many people actually wish for the A&P back!

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