Downtown Scottsdale Fry's to become a Whole Foods

[ClownLoach]

A lot of Fry’s stores seem to be dumpier nowadays….dirty floors, out-of-stock during weekends, more disheveled looking. Meanwhile the Safeways where I live are brighter and cleaner looking- produce department looks good, bakery looks tempting, deli well stocked.

You can change the word "Fry's" to "Kroger owned" in this sentence because it is representative of the conditions almost chain wide with exceptions of obvious management favorite areas/stores. All I have seen since the merger was announced is continuous improvement at Albertsons companies stores, however I have to attach the asterisk of improvements alongside disproportionately high price increases.

[ClownLoach]

After visiting half a dozen Fry's this weekend, I am baffled as to where the criticism is coming from. I've driven from Peoria to Glendale to Gilbert to Chandler to Tempe and to Scottsdale plus through the city. I would kill for a single Ralphs in SoCal that executes on the level of every Fry's I've visited. All were clean, well stocked, great perimeter. Prices weren't very good though, not much lower than SoCal (if at all).

I did see some great Safeway elements I wish were available elsewhere, saw a boring looking store in Scottsdale that had cakes in the bakery case that looked like a fine pastry shop. Must have been a unique local program.

[veteran+]

After visiting half a dozen Fry's this weekend, I am baffled as to where the criticism is coming from. I've driven from Peoria to Glendale to Gilbert to Chandler to Tempe and to Scottsdale plus through the city. I would kill for a single Ralphs in SoCal that executes on the level of every Fry's I've visited. All were clean, well stocked, great perimeter. Prices weren't very good though, not much lower than SoCal (if at all).

I did see some great Safeway elements I wish were available elsewhere, saw a boring looking store in Scottsdale that had cakes in the bakery case that looked like a fine pastry shop. Must have been a unique local program.

That's what my best friend for decades has said. She has lived there for 15 years.

[rwsandiego]

After visiting half a dozen Fry's this weekend, I am baffled as to where the criticism is coming from....

I can tell you where it is coming from. Their produce is typically on the verge of being rotten, meat isn't very good, bakery products don't have much flavor, and the stores are a mess. There are outliers (Tatum and Shea, 7th Street and Bell, Downtown Phoenix, and Laveen Village come to mind) but most are pretty dismal.

The Marketplace stores and the stores that were built as Fry's tend to be less grim than the former Smith's and Smitty's. They are pretty aggressively remodeling stores, so hopefully they are cleaning them up as they redecorate. I have high hopes for 20th and Camelback. It is undergoing a remodel into what I think is a Fresh Fare decor. (The phrase "A passion for all that's good" decorates the back wall). This is one of the stores that simply needs better management and staff. They have done a good job maintaining the Downtown Phoenix store. Some of its clientele is iffy (it is located in a decent neighborhood and is ~1.5 miles away from "oooh, don't wanna live there!") but it is adjacent to The Biltmore District and Uptown, which are not exactly the slums.

As for Safeway, the decor isn't always the best, but produce is always fresh, meat is better than Fry's, and the bakery is much better.

I will say that Fry's excels in their sushi (it's much better than Whole Foods), Murray's Cheese, and the GM/Pharmacy side of the store. Safeway is pretty bad at GM and I wouldn't buy sushi there.

[storewanderer]

After visiting half a dozen Fry's this weekend, I am baffled as to where the criticism is coming from. I've driven from Peoria to Glendale to Gilbert to Chandler to Tempe and to Scottsdale plus through the city. I would kill for a single Ralphs in SoCal that executes on the level of every Fry's I've visited. All were clean, well stocked, great perimeter. Prices weren't very good though, not much lower than SoCal (if at all).

I did see some great Safeway elements I wish were available elsewhere, saw a boring looking store in Scottsdale that had cakes in the bakery case that looked like a fine pastry shop. Must have been a unique local program.

Check out Ralphs in the South Bay area (Torrance, Manhattan Beach, Rolling Hills Estates)- excellent execution. Decent north of LAX (Marina Del Rey etc.) and even closer to Long Beach (Lakewood) also. Went into a Ralphs in Gardena which was a little rough feeling/looking and inside seemed crammed up but once you got past that the perimeter was pretty good and the employees were great (this place was a lot better executed than nearby Aldi and Vons units which had.. issues.. to be polite). Better than the average Frys/Smiths all around.

Southwest Division Safeway/Albertsons/Vons has the cake program you describe. It comes from Albertsons. Most locations do not have a decorator or the labor talented enough to execute it well. Or the bakery is too low volume so they don't offer it. You came across a store that executes it well.

Back to what you saw of Frys what I found was the stores on the perimeters of the area, Marketplace Stores, ranged from very good to excellent. You are right that their stores are well stocked. Typical Kroger. Frys reminded me of Smiths back here in NV; I may as well have been home because the merchandising/programs were identical. But once you got into the more mature areas (say, Mesa, Tempe) things seemed to start to get a little funny between physically questionable stores and lackluster execution. Again this is no different than Smiths. However I found their produce to be very fresh- too fresh (I am looking for ripe/ready to eat stuff on trips- found plenty of that at any Basha/Food City operation). I wasn't too impressed with Frys meat (Smiths seems to have better meat at lower prices). The nicer Frys had nice bakeries with some better quality products. The delis I know how the stuff is (not good)... beyond the Boar's Head product...

I suggest visiting more Bashas/Food City units and see what you think. Look hard and close at center store- notice how in some categories major brands are missing entirely (like pet food- when I was there they had almost no Friskies cat food). The lack of customers. The lack of perimeter staffing. Great basic scratch bakery program if you can get it fresh. If you are flying out of PHX I suggest you take an hour out of your time and do a journey through the Food City units on McDowell by the airport (there are 4 units pretty close together). After that journey I was already confused before, but after that I had no CLUE what Raleys did buying this chain. Despite the neighborhoods feeling uneasy I am pleased to report I had no issues. There is a newer Quik Trip in the middle of these stores also, which is also a good solid stop.

[jamcool]

A number of Fry’s sites were originally Smith’s- especially in smaller towns like Flagstaff and Cottonwood. Converted over at the time of the Kroger-Fred Meyer merger.
And Bashas’ cash cows have always been Food City, AJ’s Fine Foods and the rural stores like the Dine’ Markets.

[storewanderer]

Those Frys that were original Smiths may as well be a Smiths at this point because the stores are largely identical in mix and everything else. Just how Kroger has made everything so much "the same." The Smiths units being mostly larger give them a lot of space to work with. Usually not the nicest looking stores but nice and big on space and merchandise. Departments are well sized. Larger 80's and early 90's era Smiths Stores are great stores- big stores with good sized departments and good layouts. They feel downscale but make up for it with their space.

I think the worst units are the 80s era Frys Stores (not many of those left) and some of the former Smitty's units (the older ones again- not newer Smitty units like Rural/Ray). I think in both cases these formats are just running stores with such missized departments, cave like interiors, narrow aisles, etc. that there is not a good way to fix them short of a bulldozer.

[storewanderer]

After visiting half a dozen Fry's this weekend, I am baffled as to where the criticism is coming from....

I can tell you where it is coming from. Their produce is typically on the verge of being rotten, meat isn't very good, bakery products don't have much flavor, and the stores are a mess. There are outliers (Tatum and Shea, 7th Street and Bell, Downtown Phoenix, and Laveen Village come to mind) but most are pretty dismal.

The Marketplace stores and the stores that were built as Fry's tend to be less grim than the former Smith's and Smitty's. They are pretty aggressively remodeling stores, so hopefully they are cleaning them up as they redecorate. I have high hopes for 20th and Camelback. It is undergoing a remodel into what I think is a Fresh Fare decor. (The phrase "A passion for all that's good" decorates the back wall). This is one of the stores that simply needs better management and staff. They have done a good job maintaining the Downtown Phoenix store. Some of its clientele is iffy (it is located in a decent neighborhood and is ~1.5 miles away from "oooh, don't wanna live there!") but it is adjacent to The Biltmore District and Uptown, which are not exactly the slums.

As for Safeway, the decor isn't always the best, but produce is always fresh, meat is better than Fry's, and the bakery is much better.

I will say that Fry's excels in their sushi (it's much better than Whole Foods), Murray's Cheese, and the GM/Pharmacy side of the store. Safeway is pretty bad at GM and I wouldn't buy sushi there.

I found Frys produce to be fresher looking and better assorted than Safeway in the Phoenix market (same for Smiths vs. Albertsons/Vons in Las Vegas), also it was priced quite a bit lower. Frys is clearly selling exponentially more produce than Safeway and it shows. Southwest Albertsons/Safeway used to have a price cut thing going on produce where they price matched various items to Frys (Smiths in Las Vegas) but they seem to have discontinued that program sometime in 2023.

I also found bakery to have gone significantly downhill at the Southwest Safeway/Albertsons units in 2023; they got rid of some items they had that were "better" (like their muffins, and the better cookies were very hard to find but still present in some stores) and replaced them with standard Safeway products (which are not very good). Pricing also shot up on bakery and they seem to be doing less promotion. Kroger/Frys bakery is also pretty terrible, but they have a few good items (basically the stuff that is in bakery that is PS is quite good).

The messy condition of Frys Stores is typical for most Kroger Stores I am seeing all over, it isn't a division by division thing, it is a Kroger thing, and it is unfortunate. Wal Marts often have better aisle conditions. They just don't spend money to condition/neaten their aisles much anymore on the grocery side at Kroger (they still allocate labor to this task on the drug side of the stores). The high amount of traffic on their aisles filling up carts of items also makes for these messier conditions. The Safeway units look neater because there is hardly anyone shopping on those aisles and those who are shopping them are buying few items due to the outrageous prices.

I observed surprising execution declines with Safeway/Albertsons Phoenix/Las Vegas during 2023. These stores were previously some of the best executed stores in their entire fleet (next to immediate Boise and Jewel) with aggressive promotion efforts and strongly executed perimeters. This is no longer the case and they are starting to feel marginal. Not bad, just marginal. Their ads were weaker, prices shot up storewide, perimeter execution got worse, and in general they feel like an asset in a holding pattern. Meanwhile Smiths/Frys in these markets continues to be aggressive.

[rwsandiego]

After visiting half a dozen Fry's this weekend, I am baffled as to where the criticism is coming from....

I can tell you where it is coming from. Their produce is typically on the verge of being rotten, meat isn't very good, bakery products don't have much flavor, and the stores are a mess. There are outliers (Tatum and Shea, 7th Street and Bell, Downtown Phoenix, and Laveen Village come to mind) but most are pretty dismal.

The Marketplace stores and the stores that were built as Fry's tend to be less grim than the former Smith's and Smitty's. They are pretty aggressively remodeling stores, so hopefully they are cleaning them up as they redecorate. I have high hopes for 20th and Camelback. It is undergoing a remodel into what I think is a Fresh Fare decor. (The phrase "A passion for all that's good" decorates the back wall). This is one of the stores that simply needs better management and staff. They have done a good job maintaining the Downtown Phoenix store. Some of its clientele is iffy (it is located in a decent neighborhood and is ~1.5 miles away from "oooh, don't wanna live there!") but it is adjacent to The Biltmore District and Uptown, which are not exactly the slums.

As for Safeway, the decor isn't always the best, but produce is always fresh, meat is better than Fry's, and the bakery is much better.

I will say that Fry's excels in their sushi (it's much better than Whole Foods), Murray's Cheese, and the GM/Pharmacy side of the store. Safeway is pretty bad at GM and I wouldn't buy sushi there.

I found Frys produce to be fresher looking and better assorted than Safeway in the Phoenix market (same for Smiths vs. Albertsons/Vons in Las Vegas), also it was priced quite a bit lower. Frys is clearly selling exponentially more produce than Safeway and it shows. Southwest Albertsons/Safeway used to have a price cut thing going on produce where they price matched various items to Frys (Smiths in Las Vegas) but they seem to have discontinued that program sometime in 2023.
...

Perhaps the difference is I shop at high-volume Safeways (yes, there is such a thing) where produce and bakery don't sit for very long. The same was true in San Diego. I lived near a small, high-volume VONS and the produce was always very fresh. It was the only grocery store around and so everyone shopped there. Different story at the scary 30th Street and El Cajon Blvd VONS. I wouldn't buy any perimeter items at that store. If that wasn't enough to keep you away, the goings-on in the parking lot would keep you away.

The three Food City locations on east McDowell all started out as something else. SR 51 and McDowell was a Bashas' (the first reference I saw was dated 1974, but their ads didn't always list all store locations, so it is very likely that it is much older). 32nd and Mc Dowell was an AJ Bayless (opened in 1951). 44th and McDowell was a Southwest Supermarkets. The neighborhoods are pretty unsavory looking and I would never live there, but they are better than West Phoenix. If you want a real adventure, visit the Food City stores on 51st Avenue and Mc Dowell or 35th Avenue and Van Buren. I'm kidding - don't go there!

@storewanderer , you are right about the few remaining older Fry's stores. Many of the 1980's era stores were taken over by Goodwill after the Smith's merger, as the Smith's stores were larger and newer. You are also spot-on about the older Smitty's stores. There are a couple in Tempe that feel like someone's basement. Then there's the one on Hatcher near Cave Creek and 7th Street. Fry's ought to be ashamed of themselves for that store.

I was at the Tatum and Shea Marketplace on Sunday, which was the first time I visited since the remodel was complete. They really did a nice job. That's the thing about Fry's - their stores are either spectacular or they are dumps. There's no in-between.

[storewanderer]

I don't know what it is with Safeway and produce. It seems like some stores are able to rotate it correctly and others just can't make it happen. Many of the NorCal Stores do good enough sales and have small backrooms so the produce properly flows in and quickly gets put out/sells. I have had numerous quality issues with produce at Safeway. I do not have quality issues with Smiths or even WinCo produce but there are many times I will not buy at Smiths (specifically any berries- I am done) or WinCo because the product does not look good. Safeway has fooled me so many times with stuff that I think looks good then I buy it and it is either rotten, dry, doesn't ripen properly, etc. Their prices are way too high on produce to excuse these types of quality issues. If this was Food City selling 4 pounds of Honeycrisp Apples for 99 cents I may cut them some slack and not be surprised if the stuff isn't good. They get a high concentration of specialty items from the supplier Melissa's (who Wal Mart and Raleys are also working heavily with now) and the Safeway prices are outrageous and these items just sit and sit and sit in most stores. NorCal Safeway has a thing where they put this full mix of produce in EVERY store even if it does not sell (rural, etc.). They did finally cut a lot of the Organic at these stores where stuff doesn't sell but the specialty stuff remains. And when it does not sell it does not get rotated it just sits there for weeks and weeks. That Southwest Division as it is puts out significantly less produce than the typical NorCal Store puts out, many locations are not on that specialty program at all.

The common denominator with Frys and Kroger in general (except Ralphs/QFC) seems to be that the stores skew larger and even if the store is a dump it will have aisles and aisles of products and a good overall acceptably priced product mix on those aisles. Perimeter may not be great but center store is where they typically do what I expect of them. Also it is still rare I wait for checkout with Kroger as their self checkouts are mostly all open, but I can say the same for Safeway the past few years too as they've added self checkouts. But I wait in line at Safeway a lot more than Smiths due to either unstaffed self checkouts, too few self checkouts (some stores still only have 4 self checkouts, but they are trying to get 6 in every store and 8 in busier stores), or pricing complications.