Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by mjhale »

buckguy wrote: July 2nd, 2022, 6:26 am MicroCenter is slow growing for a reason---they once had over 100 stores and now have just 25. They nearly went out of business about 10 years ago. They straddled the hobby market and broader consumer market, but had problems once PCs became commodity items and it no longer paid to build your own while more and more mass market places sold PCs and peripherals. The smaller specialty stores that sold software, PCs or hobbyist gear vanished pretty quickly but that didn't mean they had a huge residual market to exploit. I seem to remember that they already were closing stores in the '00s---like the one in Manassas, VA, well before they almost went under.

They have stabilized in recent years but the stores seem to be a mixed bag. I periodically go to one in Rockville, MD (cramped, dingy, not very well staffed) and one in Mayfield Heights, Ohio (brighter, well laid out and staffed with knowledgeable people). I've also been to the flagship in Columbus, Ohio which was nicely laid out but not very well staffed. Most of their stores seem to be recycled discount or big box stores. I forget what used to be in Rockville. The one in Mayfield Heights was a long-running Zayre and a local full-line department store before that. I'm glad they're still around as they do fill a niche--broader selection than Best Buy et al. and if you're lucky, you get knowledgeable sales people. They also have an online business with periodic mailings which I assume has helped them survive. They always seem to have store traffic--I usually stop in Rockville during off times from work and the place is never empty. The Mayfield store does a a sizable weekend business---so I assume they have found a scale and business model that works and if they have the capital to begin upgrading the stores, hopefully they will stick around and do better. They also opened a couple stores in NYC a few years ago which I would guess is another positive sign.
I wasn't aware that Microcenter had severe problems and downsized as much as you describe. I had always thought that they were a niche player, more focused on the DIY/hobbyist and higher in terms of knowledge computer user. My experience with Microcenter has mainly been with the Fairfax, VA store. I would shop there after CompUSA went bust. It was mainly parts to upgrade various desktop PCs that I owned. I also purchased all of the parts to build the last PC I owned from them. I generally find Microcenter employees to be professional and knowledgeable. In the past five years or so I have noticed more of an overt focus on getting a sale. Like every salesperson asking if I need help or multiple salespeople trying to put their sticker on the products I am buying to get a commission. After I got rid of my last desktop PC and bought a laptop, my needs for ongoing parts and "stuff" has gone way down. I agree that as PCs have become a commodity item and as mobile computing has taken over people aren't doing the DIY thing nearly as much. Gaming and things like Raspberry Pi don't have a broad audience, though the audience they have is highly dedicated. My recent computer purchases have been things like flash drives, external hard drives and a printer. Those aren't things that I have to go to Microcenter for. I was able to find much of what I needed at Best Buy and Office Depot which are much closer to where I live. I do hope that Microcenter can stay around. They do fill the not quite "commoner" computer market and the not quite I have to get it online part of the market. They also have a good service department that friends of mine have had success with.

By the way, the Rockville Microcenter was formerly a CompUSA. Microcenter got the location when CompUSA liquidated. Even when CompUSA was there it had the same interior feel that you describe of Microcenter. For some reason Microcenter decided to go with darker colors when they remodeled the space. That makes it feel even smaller. CompUSA stuck with white and bright with primary colors from what I remember. Before CompUSA the entire building was a Bradlees. The original tenant was Memco. Bradlees retained the thumbnail awnings until they closed. It was after Bradlees closed that the space was subdivided up into all of the store spaces that are there now. Interesting side note is that in the late 80s Hechinger purchased a number of Bradless leases including the one for this space. The intent was to use the former Bradless locations to upgrade existing Hechinger stores or to lease out to other retailers. At least in the DC area nothing much came of this initiative.
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by Bagels »

mjhale wrote: July 2nd, 2022, 2:36 pm
buckguy wrote: July 2nd, 2022, 6:26 am MicroCenter is slow growing for a reason---they once had over 100 stores and now have just 25. They nearly went out of business about 10 years ago. They straddled the hobby market and broader consumer market, but had problems once PCs became commodity items and it no longer paid to build your own while more and more mass market places sold PCs and peripherals. The smaller specialty stores that sold software, PCs or hobbyist gear vanished pretty quickly but that didn't mean they had a huge residual market to exploit. I seem to remember that they already were closing stores in the '00s---like the one in Manassas, VA, well before they almost went under.

They have stabilized in recent years but the stores seem to be a mixed bag. I periodically go to one in Rockville, MD (cramped, dingy, not very well staffed) and one in Mayfield Heights, Ohio (brighter, well laid out and staffed with knowledgeable people). I've also been to the flagship in Columbus, Ohio which was nicely laid out but not very well staffed. Most of their stores seem to be recycled discount or big box stores. I forget what used to be in Rockville. The one in Mayfield Heights was a long-running Zayre and a local full-line department store before that. I'm glad they're still around as they do fill a niche--broader selection than Best Buy et al. and if you're lucky, you get knowledgeable sales people. They also have an online business with periodic mailings which I assume has helped them survive. They always seem to have store traffic--I usually stop in Rockville during off times from work and the place is never empty. The Mayfield store does a a sizable weekend business---so I assume they have found a scale and business model that works and if they have the capital to begin upgrading the stores, hopefully they will stick around and do better. They also opened a couple stores in NYC a few years ago which I would guess is another positive sign.
I wasn't aware that Microcenter had severe problems and downsized as much as you describe. I had always thought that they were a niche player, more focused on the DIY/hobbyist and higher in terms of knowledge computer user. My experience with Microcenter has mainly been with the Fairfax, VA store. I would shop there after CompUSA went bust. It was mainly parts to upgrade various desktop PCs that I owned. I also purchased all of the parts to build the last PC I owned from them. I generally find Microcenter employees to be professional and knowledgeable. In the past five years or so I have noticed more of an overt focus on getting a sale. Like every salesperson asking if I need help or multiple salespeople trying to put their sticker on the products I am buying to get a commission. After I got rid of my last desktop PC and bought a laptop, my needs for ongoing parts and "stuff" has gone way down. I agree that as PCs have become a commodity item and as mobile computing has taken over people aren't doing the DIY thing nearly as much. Gaming and things like Raspberry Pi don't have a broad audience, though the audience they have is highly dedicated. My recent computer purchases have been things like flash drives, external hard drives and a printer. Those aren't things that I have to go to Microcenter for. I was able to find much of what I needed at Best Buy and Office Depot which are much closer to where I live. I do hope that Microcenter can stay around. They do fill the not quite "commoner" computer market and the not quite I have to get it online part of the market. They also have a good service department that friends of mine have had success with.

By the way, the Rockville Microcenter was formerly a CompUSA. Microcenter got the location when CompUSA liquidated. Even when CompUSA was there it had the same interior feel that you describe of Microcenter. For some reason Microcenter decided to go with darker colors when they remodeled the space. That makes it feel even smaller. CompUSA stuck with white and bright with primary colors from what I remember. Before CompUSA the entire building was a Bradlees. The original tenant was Memco. Bradlees retained the thumbnail awnings until they closed. It was after Bradlees closed that the space was subdivided up into all of the store spaces that are there now. Interesting side note is that in the late 80s Hechinger purchased a number of Bradless leases including the one for this space. The intent was to use the former Bradless locations to upgrade existing Hechinger stores or to lease out to other retailers. At least in the DC area nothing much came of this initiative.
Looking at historical versions of their website via the Internet Archive, Microcenter had 12 stores in 1998, 20 in 2004, 21 in 2009 and 23 in 2014. Some of these locations have closed, but they’re at 25 locations today.

Microcenter has always been a niche player. I think the OP had them mixed up :).
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by BatteryMill »

buckguy wrote: July 2nd, 2022, 6:26 am MicroCenter is slow growing for a reason---they once had over 100 stores and now have just 25. They nearly went out of business about 10 years ago. They straddled the hobby market and broader consumer market, but had problems once PCs became commodity items and it no longer paid to build your own while more and more mass market places sold PCs and peripherals. The smaller specialty stores that sold software, PCs or hobbyist gear vanished pretty quickly but that didn't mean they had a huge residual market to exploit. I seem to remember that they already were closing stores in the '00s---like the one in Manassas, VA, well before they almost went under.

They have stabilized in recent years but the stores seem to be a mixed bag. I periodically go to one in Rockville, MD (cramped, dingy, not very well staffed) and one in Mayfield Heights, Ohio (brighter, well laid out and staffed with knowledgeable people). I've also been to the flagship in Columbus, Ohio which was nicely laid out but not very well staffed. Most of their stores seem to be recycled discount or big box stores. I forget what used to be in Rockville. The one in Mayfield Heights was a long-running Zayre and a local full-line department store before that. I'm glad they're still around as they do fill a niche--broader selection than Best Buy et al. and if you're lucky, you get knowledgeable sales people. They also have an online business with periodic mailings which I assume has helped them survive. They always seem to have store traffic--I usually stop in Rockville during off times from work and the place is never empty. The Mayfield store does a a sizable weekend business---so I assume they have found a scale and business model that works and if they have the capital to begin upgrading the stores, hopefully they will stick around and do better. They also opened a couple stores in NYC a few years ago which I would guess is another positive sign.
Side note, was there a Micro Center in Manassas? I've looked through their store locator and noticed the Fairfax location has been the only one persistently present.
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by ClownLoach »

Bagels wrote: July 2nd, 2022, 3:00 pm
mjhale wrote: July 2nd, 2022, 2:36 pm
buckguy wrote: July 2nd, 2022, 6:26 am MicroCenter is slow growing for a reason---they once had over 100 stores and now have just 25. They nearly went out of business about 10 years ago. They straddled the hobby market and broader consumer market, but had problems once PCs became commodity items and it no longer paid to build your own while more and more mass market places sold PCs and peripherals. The smaller specialty stores that sold software, PCs or hobbyist gear vanished pretty quickly but that didn't mean they had a huge residual market to exploit. I seem to remember that they already were closing stores in the '00s---like the one in Manassas, VA, well before they almost went under.

They have stabilized in recent years but the stores seem to be a mixed bag. I periodically go to one in Rockville, MD (cramped, dingy, not very well staffed) and one in Mayfield Heights, Ohio (brighter, well laid out and staffed with knowledgeable people). I've also been to the flagship in Columbus, Ohio which was nicely laid out but not very well staffed. Most of their stores seem to be recycled discount or big box stores. I forget what used to be in Rockville. The one in Mayfield Heights was a long-running Zayre and a local full-line department store before that. I'm glad they're still around as they do fill a niche--broader selection than Best Buy et al. and if you're lucky, you get knowledgeable sales people. They also have an online business with periodic mailings which I assume has helped them survive. They always seem to have store traffic--I usually stop in Rockville during off times from work and the place is never empty. The Mayfield store does a a sizable weekend business---so I assume they have found a scale and business model that works and if they have the capital to begin upgrading the stores, hopefully they will stick around and do better. They also opened a couple stores in NYC a few years ago which I would guess is another positive sign.
I wasn't aware that Microcenter had severe problems and downsized as much as you describe. I had always thought that they were a niche player, more focused on the DIY/hobbyist and higher in terms of knowledge computer user. My experience with Microcenter has mainly been with the Fairfax, VA store. I would shop there after CompUSA went bust. It was mainly parts to upgrade various desktop PCs that I owned. I also purchased all of the parts to build the last PC I owned from them. I generally find Microcenter employees to be professional and knowledgeable. In the past five years or so I have noticed more of an overt focus on getting a sale. Like every salesperson asking if I need help or multiple salespeople trying to put their sticker on the products I am buying to get a commission. After I got rid of my last desktop PC and bought a laptop, my needs for ongoing parts and "stuff" has gone way down. I agree that as PCs have become a commodity item and as mobile computing has taken over people aren't doing the DIY thing nearly as much. Gaming and things like Raspberry Pi don't have a broad audience, though the audience they have is highly dedicated. My recent computer purchases have been things like flash drives, external hard drives and a printer. Those aren't things that I have to go to Microcenter for. I was able to find much of what I needed at Best Buy and Office Depot which are much closer to where I live. I do hope that Microcenter can stay around. They do fill the not quite "commoner" computer market and the not quite I have to get it online part of the market. They also have a good service department that friends of mine have had success with.

By the way, the Rockville Microcenter was formerly a CompUSA. Microcenter got the location when CompUSA liquidated. Even when CompUSA was there it had the same interior feel that you describe of Microcenter. For some reason Microcenter decided to go with darker colors when they remodeled the space. That makes it feel even smaller. CompUSA stuck with white and bright with primary colors from what I remember. Before CompUSA the entire building was a Bradlees. The original tenant was Memco. Bradlees retained the thumbnail awnings until they closed. It was after Bradlees closed that the space was subdivided up into all of the store spaces that are there now. Interesting side note is that in the late 80s Hechinger purchased a number of Bradless leases including the one for this space. The intent was to use the former Bradless locations to upgrade existing Hechinger stores or to lease out to other retailers. At least in the DC area nothing much came of this initiative.
Looking at historical versions of their website via the Internet Archive, Microcenter had 12 stores in 1998, 20 in 2004, 21 in 2009 and 23 in 2014. Some of these locations have closed, but they’re at 25 locations today.

Microcenter has always been a niche player. I think the OP had them mixed up :).
I wonder if they're mixing up TigerDirect and Micro Center. I thought TigerDirect matches that store count, about 100 at their peak before they vaporized?

I don't believe Micro Center has ever had more than about 25 stores. It is my understanding that they are a slow growing company by design because they don't take on debt to build new stores, remodel etc. - anything they do is paid for right out of the company checking account. This makes them an incredibly stable company in one of the most unstable sectors of retail. I am not sure how many stores are owned vs rented - I would assume very few are leases. If they can get their act together and make them all match that Tustin store I think that would be more productive than adding any more store count. The only thing that isn't working in Tustin is the fact that they eliminated the stock room except for a tiny receiving room - they do so much volume that they are winding up with pallets of freight being offloaded in the evening and left all over the sales floor, waiting to be worked by the overnight team. But it is still a remarkable transition - the store turned out to be the same size as a large Best Buy - they had way too much space wasted in offices, storage rooms and other weird nooks and crannys before. I think more than half the square footage of the store was off the sales floor before the remodel, now 95% of the building is customer space.

And make no mistake - that Tustin store is clearly doing the volume Fry's was in their heyday in PC Components. That department even before the remodel is busier than anywhere else I've seen. The winding, snaking queue for the component desk before the remodel wound through half the store on weekends and took hours to get through, then you had to take your paperwork to checkout which was another beastly line. They must have recognized the similarities to the famed bureaucracy of Fry's which had all the efficiency of the DMV and streamlined the model in the new remodel which allows payment in department, more than doubled the checklanes etc.

The only Micro Center store closure I know of is one in the San Jose area which shut down while Fry's still ruled the world of BYO computer parts. I would imagine that they will find a space for one in the future after the demise of Fry's.
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by buckguy »

Bradlee's bought Memco's stores, but Bradlee's wasn't at Federal Plaza (MicroCenter). It was at the plaza that now has Giant and Marshall's on Montrose and the Pike. The 2 story layout at that part of Federal Plaza is an odd one, although it's a sloping site that makes it useful, but I've wondered what the original tenants were---the back parking lot is little used even though its less of an obstacle course than the main one. I do remember the CompUSA. There were some other computer businesses in that area in the smaller strips nearby.

I've been on MicroCenter's mailing list for years and they have closed stores, including some in Florida and one in Santa Clara. There have been recurring rumors of bankruptcy, some of them tracable to a single person who overheard a conversation at a trade show and the rumors probably stoked by CompUSA, Circuit City et al. going out of business and any store closings they made. Just look here, a few routine store closings and people begin assuming doom.
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by wnetmacman »

ClownLoach wrote: December 6th, 2021, 11:06 pm On a different note - Micro Center is a super slow growing chain with only one store in California - Tustin. These stores have all been very dingy and dated looking, with strange dividing walls and small rooms similar to the oldest Circuit City locations. This Tustin store was just fully gutted and remodeled over a six month period, and it is absolutely the best looking large electronics store I have ever seen. Apparently just like Circuit City they had lots of stock rooms and other non sales spaces - all those walls were removed, all drop ceilings removed, and the store is just incredibly impressive. It feels like they tripled the size of the store which tells you how much wasted space they had before. The perimeter is three core areas - computers (already built), electronics including a new TV department and a massive 3D printing section, and then Build Your Own PC. The BYO PC area is without a doubt the best I have ever seen. Somehow they manage to pack more assortment of computer components into this store than even Fry's had. They finally have a sense of style to the store and for the most part they have great what I call "A-B merchandising" in most categories of a display unit of a live product with box below so you can see what you're considering a purchase of. Target and Walmart in general just have boxed stock but even Best Buy in recent years has removed display models of many categories. Every fixture has built in lighting so the store just looks fabulous. It's pretty clear that Micro Center spared no expense on this remodel which clearly establishes a new prototype they can build hundreds of across the country. If I worked for Best Buy and saw this I would either be horrified by it - or I would make a deal to buy them out and start building hundreds of them. Only room for improvement in my eyes would be the Audio/Video department but they didn't really sell TVs before and probably don't want to sink a lot of money into inventory until they know how customers react.
Micro Center would not work in smaller areas; here's why:

Micro Center needs MASSIVE sales in their stores to make money. Not just the volume of Best Buy. Plus, BB gives you appliances, full home theatre and full mobile services. MC does not do that - they are a supermarket for computers, with everything a hobbyist or experienced tech needs (I'm in the latter category). With advances in tech being what they are these days, things move too fast for the average inventory turn that MC needs to stay profitable. Thus, they have less than 30 stores, including 2 in Texas that I've been to recently (I was in Dallas on Saturday). They are highly competitive, on the Newegg lever, but not able to do so to that scale.
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by architect »

wnetmacman wrote: July 5th, 2022, 2:55 pm
ClownLoach wrote: December 6th, 2021, 11:06 pm On a different note - Micro Center is a super slow growing chain with only one store in California - Tustin. These stores have all been very dingy and dated looking, with strange dividing walls and small rooms similar to the oldest Circuit City locations. This Tustin store was just fully gutted and remodeled over a six month period, and it is absolutely the best looking large electronics store I have ever seen. Apparently just like Circuit City they had lots of stock rooms and other non sales spaces - all those walls were removed, all drop ceilings removed, and the store is just incredibly impressive. It feels like they tripled the size of the store which tells you how much wasted space they had before. The perimeter is three core areas - computers (already built), electronics including a new TV department and a massive 3D printing section, and then Build Your Own PC. The BYO PC area is without a doubt the best I have ever seen. Somehow they manage to pack more assortment of computer components into this store than even Fry's had. They finally have a sense of style to the store and for the most part they have great what I call "A-B merchandising" in most categories of a display unit of a live product with box below so you can see what you're considering a purchase of. Target and Walmart in general just have boxed stock but even Best Buy in recent years has removed display models of many categories. Every fixture has built in lighting so the store just looks fabulous. It's pretty clear that Micro Center spared no expense on this remodel which clearly establishes a new prototype they can build hundreds of across the country. If I worked for Best Buy and saw this I would either be horrified by it - or I would make a deal to buy them out and start building hundreds of them. Only room for improvement in my eyes would be the Audio/Video department but they didn't really sell TVs before and probably don't want to sink a lot of money into inventory until they know how customers react.
Micro Center would not work in smaller areas; here's why:

Micro Center needs MASSIVE sales in their stores to make money. Not just the volume of Best Buy. Plus, BB gives you appliances, full home theatre and full mobile services. MC does not do that - they are a supermarket for computers, with everything a hobbyist or experienced tech needs (I'm in the latter category). With advances in tech being what they are these days, things move too fast for the average inventory turn that MC needs to stay profitable. Thus, they have less than 30 stores, including 2 in Texas that I've been to recently (I was in Dallas on Saturday). They are highly competitive, on the Newegg lever, but not able to do so to that scale.
Speaking of the Texas stores, I'm very surprised that they haven't opened a store in Austin yet, considering that it is a major US tech hub and there is little to no brick and mortar competition since the downfall of Fry's. Plus, an Austin location would also be close enough to pull from the San Antonio metro.
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by Brian Lutz »

As someone who has built my fair share of PCs over the years I used to have a local computer shop (Computer Stop in Bellevue) that I really liked and spent way too much at, but those now seem to be a thing of the past in most places. Best Buy seems to be pretty much the only place I know of locally that has any PC components at all, and their selection tends to be pretty thin on those (they have managed to put together a pretty good selection of peripherals over the last few years though, just in time for many of the enthusiasts to stop buying those in favor of $300+ customized boutique keyboards with exotic switches nobody outside of r/mechanicalkeyboards has ever heard of.) Fry's used to be a decent source of components before they went down the tubes (several years before they went out of business) but now the options are pretty much a paper-thin selection at Best Buy plus Amazon and Newegg (and even Newegg has taken some hits to their reputation among the PC enthusiast community over perceived price gouging during the component and video card shortages of the past couple of years.)
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Re: Best Buy and the Smartphone Era

Post by wnetmacman »

architect wrote: July 5th, 2022, 5:48 pm
wnetmacman wrote: July 5th, 2022, 2:55 pm Micro Center would not work in smaller areas; here's why:

Micro Center needs MASSIVE sales in their stores to make money. Not just the volume of Best Buy. Plus, BB gives you appliances, full home theatre and full mobile services. MC does not do that - they are a supermarket for computers, with everything a hobbyist or experienced tech needs (I'm in the latter category). With advances in tech being what they are these days, things move too fast for the average inventory turn that MC needs to stay profitable. Thus, they have less than 30 stores, including 2 in Texas that I've been to recently (I was in Dallas on Saturday). They are highly competitive, on the Newegg lever, but not able to do so to that scale.
Speaking of the Texas stores, I'm very surprised that they haven't opened a store in Austin yet, considering that it is a major US tech hub and there is little to no brick and mortar competition since the downfall of Fry's. Plus, an Austin location would also be close enough to pull from the San Antonio metro.
Austin is still (marginally) too small for Micro Center to work. Believe me, if they could even put one in each state, some states wouldn't qualify *for the entire state*. What I see each time I go to Houston or Dallas is a super-massive metro area where the store is in or near the tech corridor. That's why they work; Dallas is literally across the freeway from the Texas Instruments world headquarters.

Fry's; well, we've covered that here ad nauseam so I won't go there.
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