Brian Lutz wrote: ↑February 23rd, 2023, 10:33 am
I'm a little surprised Walmart has much presence in Portland in the first place, it seems like the big West Coast blue cities (Seattle, Portland, SF, etc.) are generally run by people that are extremely hostile toward Walmart (and if they don't succeed in keeping them away there's plenty of other activist types that'll try to get them shut down.) Sam's Club did have one store in Seattle but it closed when they pulled out of the Pacific Northwest, and was promptly taken over by squatters.
That said, there aren't many options for Walmart to open stores in some of these areas, especially with limited and expensive real estate. In order to open a store in Bellevue Walmart opted to turn a vacant former Mervyn's in Factoria Mall (Marketplace at Factoria) into a Supercenter store. It was a rather small (70k SF) and awkwardly laid out store, and I suspect it didn't do well because they opted not to renew the 10 year lease and closed it in April of 2022.
Walmart has been a non-factor in the Portland area. I'm not sure if there is any other metro area where Walmart has a smaller presence/market share than Portland. From the tough land-use laws making large stores hard to site to city officials doing whatever they can to block them, this isn't an area where Walmart does much business.
The Hayden Meadows store was only about 85,000 sq ft yet was still considered a superstore. The few times I've been there, it was always busy. The city let them in since the zoning for the area allowed larger format stores and it replaced a vacant Best catalog showroom store that for some reason never opened. The Eastport Plaza store is a redeveloped shopping mall where they snuck in. The still-open Tigard store was supposed to be a Target but the developer at the last minute changed the tenant after the store was approved and Target pulled out of the location. The building footprint is a Target store. Wood Village seemed to welcome them in. Contrast that with Vancouver where Walmart has four stores plus a neighborhood market.
The Oregonian story above is a joke as the writer failed to mention the real reason these store is closing is because of massive theft issues. She doesn't even seem to bother to ask the Walmart spokesperson about theft. Totally clueless!
Look for more store closures in the area. The Target at Jantzen Beach has massive issues with theft. The shelves are often bare. Now the store has many aisles behind glass cases locked up. They have multiple well-armed wannabe SWAT officers walking the store. If the new bridge proposal actually happens, as I understand it, the only access to the island will be from Delta Park over a special bridge. No direct access off I-5. The will kill off the remaining retail.
Until Portland starts taking shoplifting seriously, more stores will close. Just last week, Nike asked for off-duty police officers (which Nike would pay for) be stationed at both the downtown store and the outlet on MLK. The city turned them down. The MLK store has been closed for months, expect the downtown store to close as well.
Jantzen Beach and Hayden Meadows as a whole seems to be declining. Several restaurants have shut down now including Cracker Barrel, Stanford's, Elmer's, and recently announced was B.J.'s.
What always puzzled me though is how Portland welcomed some retailers with open arms in the Jantzen Beach/Hayden Meadows area and allowed them to open massive stores with no opposition. Those include Lowe's (which is practically across from the Hayden Meadows Walmart), Target, Home Depot, Floor & Decor, as well as other big-boxes that have opened during various stages of redevelopment at Jantzen Beach. Yet Walmart was only allowed into an existing building and that Hayden Meadows store seemed set up to fail.
Worth noting is that there is still a conventional Walmart just to the south on 82nd. Ave. at Otty Road, which isn't too far from Eastport Plaza. That one was originally a Home Depot, which moved just to the north to a former Home Base at 82nd & Johnson Creek when Home Base closed.
Walmart doesn't typically sell to a competitor, and Fred Meyer did close their store at 82nd & Foster, but I gotta wonder if Fred Meyer could make a go at Eastport. Although Fred Meyer is obviously dealing with theft as evidenced by the Gateway store...
I'm wondering what these two vacant stores will turn into. The Hayden Meadow's store might be a great spot for At Home. It would blend well with Lowe's and the several furniture stores in the area. Hobby Lobby is another option. Both chains are actively scouting the Portland market. The Eastport Plaza store is a bit more challenging since most major chains are already on 82nd. Might work for At Home but I would imagine they'd want to be closer to Clackamas. Hobby Lobby is coming to Mall 205 so that's unlikely. Would be a great spot for Lowe's but it's likely too small. Perhaps Maybe it will become another Asian food store/mall.
On a side note, the Jantzen Beach Floor & Decor store is puzzling to me. It sits in the footprint of the new bridge so if that project moves forward, it's a goner. I would have thought that would have prevented anyone from building there.
WM is a non-factor in southeast Michigan/Detroit---they face Meijer everywhere in Michigan and only are anywhere close to dominating in a few corners of the state where they got in first (the Thumb and the remote Upper Peninsula). WM has a faint malodor of desperation (which doesn't exist at Meijer)...all socioeconomic classes can shop legitimately at Meijer without excuse.
I think it's clear that Walmart is a rural / exurban / suburban retailer. It's business model just doesn't work in urban areas (like Target's seems to). The vast majority of closures over the last several years seem to have been stores opened within the last 20 years or so in urban settings. These sites are either undersized, reuses from other retailers, or in locations experiencing socioeconomic decline which leads to theft. The problem is that Walmart is trying to push Walmart+ and appeal to higher income urban shoppers through Walmart.com and the lack of physical stores in these areas will challenge their ability to do that.
I'd imagine that eventually Walmart will pretty much be a suburban / exurban / rural chain on the coasts (with very few urban / inner ring stores remaining in these areas) and will only have urban / inner ring stores in markets where they are market share leaders.
Romr123 wrote: ↑February 23rd, 2023, 6:10 pm
WM is a non-factor in southeast Michigan/Detroit---they face Meijer everywhere in Michigan and only are anywhere close to dominating in a few corners of the state where they got in first (the Thumb and the remote Upper Peninsula). WM has a faint malodor of desperation (which doesn't exist at Meijer)...all socioeconomic classes can shop legitimately at Meijer without excuse.
Walmart didn't enter SE Michigan / Detroit until the late 1990s / early 2000s. SE Michigan was a very strong market for Kmart until Fast Eddie destroyed it.
I believe Sam's Club existed for a few years in SE Michigan (former PACE stores) before Walmart did.
babs wrote: ↑February 23rd, 2023, 10:50 am
Walmart has been a non-factor in the Portland area. I'm not sure if there is any other metro area where Walmart has a smaller presence/market share than Portland. From the tough land-use laws making large stores hard to site to city officials doing whatever they can to block them, this isn't an area where Walmart does much business.
The Oregonian story above is a joke as the writer failed to mention the real reason these store is closing is because of massive theft issues. She doesn't even seem to bother to ask the Walmart spokesperson about theft. Totally clueless!
Look for more store closures in the area.
That Wood Village Store is very busy though. I didn't feel particularly safe at that store, but it was better than these two that are closing. I did go there at 10 PM.
My concern is Wal Mart tends to do a nice job attracting a lot of issues (theft, etc.). If they close those issues will not go away, they will just go to whatever retailers are left in the areas. Then what? Do those retailers end up having to close too?
The situation for retailers in Portland has become very strange and the attitude of city leadership is odd. I am wondering if the lack of sales tax being generated somehow makes city leadership have this attitude. I was shocked Nike's request was denied.
babs wrote: ↑February 23rd, 2023, 10:50 am
Walmart has been a non-factor in the Portland area. I'm not sure if there is any other metro area where Walmart has a smaller presence/market share than Portland. From the tough land-use laws making large stores hard to site to city officials doing whatever they can to block them, this isn't an area where Walmart does much business.
The Oregonian story above is a joke as the writer failed to mention the real reason these store is closing is because of massive theft issues. She doesn't even seem to bother to ask the Walmart spokesperson about theft. Totally clueless!
Look for more store closures in the area.
That Wood Village Store is very busy though. I didn't feel particularly safe at that store, but it was better than these two that are closing. I did go there at 10 PM.
My concern is Wal Mart tends to do a nice job attracting a lot of issues (theft, etc.). If they close those issues will not go away, they will just go to whatever retailers are left in the areas. Then what? Do those retailers end up having to close too?
The situation for retailers in Portland has become very strange and the attitude of city leadership is odd. I am wondering if the lack of sales tax being generated somehow makes city leadership have this attitude. I was shocked Nike's request was denied.
When I was there a few months ago I was surprised to see the Target next to the airport off I-205 looked like it was turning into one of these "locked down" stores. It was mid-remodel but what was concerning was the presence of big, tough looking armed security guards at the front end. These guys looked like they were ready for combat, with body armor and body cameras. Multiple security vehicles circling the parking lot. No customer could walk in there and not be alarmed by the presence of this level of security. I had always thought this particular isolated location was in a relatively safe area. Portland is a complete mess, and Walmart leaving isn't really going to mean anything to them because of the zero sales tax. Their property taxes are some of the highest in the nation so it isn't like the cops aren't being paid to take care of stores. I did not see the intense homeless activity or locked down stores just across the bridge in Vancouver. When I first started going to Portland and Vancouver a decade ago the situation was the opposite - Vancouver was the grungy, run down town with homelessness issues and crime. They cleaned up the town at the same time Portland went easy on crime and then started allowing the mass demolition of true affordable housing to be replaced by luxury apartments and condos. My understanding is that they determine "affordable" as being a certain percentage below the average market rent. That could be hundreds, if not a few thousand, above the price being charged by the old buildings being torn down. If these Walmart stores were the hubs of shoplifting I expect they were then I wonder what the situation will look like when they close. Where do the shoplifters move to? Target clearly isn't the success being described here either with the move to downsize the once-ballyhooed downtown "City" store that they spent a massive fortune on. I haven't seen anything like the paramilitary level security at any SoCal store even in rougher areas.
babs wrote: ↑February 23rd, 2023, 10:50 am
Walmart has been a non-factor in the Portland area. I'm not sure if there is any other metro area where Walmart has a smaller presence/market share than Portland. From the tough land-use laws making large stores hard to site to city officials doing whatever they can to block them, this isn't an area where Walmart does much business.
The Oregonian story above is a joke as the writer failed to mention the real reason these store is closing is because of massive theft issues. She doesn't even seem to bother to ask the Walmart spokesperson about theft. Totally clueless!
Look for more store closures in the area.
That Wood Village Store is very busy though. I didn't feel particularly safe at that store, but it was better than these two that are closing. I did go there at 10 PM.
My concern is Wal Mart tends to do a nice job attracting a lot of issues (theft, etc.). If they close those issues will not go away, they will just go to whatever retailers are left in the areas. Then what? Do those retailers end up having to close too?
The situation for retailers in Portland has become very strange and the attitude of city leadership is odd. I am wondering if the lack of sales tax being generated somehow makes city leadership have this attitude. I was shocked Nike's request was denied.
When I was there a few months ago I was surprised to see the Target next to the airport off I-205 looked like it was turning into one of these "locked down" stores. It was mid-remodel but what was concerning was the presence of big, tough looking armed security guards at the front end. These guys looked like they were ready for combat, with body armor and body cameras. Multiple security vehicles circling the parking lot. No customer could walk in there and not be alarmed by the presence of this level of security. I had always thought this particular isolated location was in a relatively safe area. Portland is a complete mess, and Walmart leaving isn't really going to mean anything to them because of the zero sales tax. Their property taxes are some of the highest in the nation so it isn't like the cops aren't being paid to take care of stores. I did not see the intense homeless activity or locked down stores just across the bridge in Vancouver. When I first started going to Portland and Vancouver a decade ago the situation was the opposite - Vancouver was the grungy, run down town with homelessness issues and crime. They cleaned up the town at the same time Portland went easy on crime and then started allowing the mass demolition of true affordable housing to be replaced by luxury apartments and condos. My understanding is that they determine "affordable" as being a certain percentage below the average market rent. That could be hundreds, if not a few thousand, above the price being charged by the old buildings being torn down. If these Walmart stores were the hubs of shoplifting I expect they were then I wonder what the situation will look like when they close. Where do the shoplifters move to? Target clearly isn't the success being described here either with the move to downsize the once-ballyhooed downtown "City" store that they spent a massive fortune on. I haven't seen anything like the paramilitary level security at any SoCal store even in rougher areas.
That area around Cascade Station and nearby Marine Drive has started declining as it has attracted homeless which have left other areas. There was a homeless camp right behind the IKEA store at one point, and many of the side streets have attracted dilapidated RVs. This area does draw shoppers from Vancouver because of the lack of sales tax.
Vancouver has seen a lot of growth as people have been fleeing Portland, and people are even looking further north to towns such as Ridgefield (where Costco recently announced a new store). Affordable housing is becoming an issue in Southwest Washington too though...this has driven up the price of housing whether buying or renting. Even in areas such as Longview-Kelso, where the economy is struggling, housing has skyrocketed. I bought my home in 2005 and it is nearing the point where it will have tripled in value. Walmart seems to do better on this side of the river...Longview has two stores, Woodland has one, Battle Ground has one, and Vancouver has several, although they did close one of the Neighborhood Market locations. But there are signs that theft is rising as those lot cop cameras are appearing....
babs wrote: ↑February 23rd, 2023, 10:50 am
Walmart has been a non-factor in the Portland area. I'm not sure if there is any other metro area where Walmart has a smaller presence/market share than Portland. From the tough land-use laws making large stores hard to site to city officials doing whatever they can to block them, this isn't an area where Walmart does much business.
The Oregonian story above is a joke as the writer failed to mention the real reason these store is closing is because of massive theft issues. She doesn't even seem to bother to ask the Walmart spokesperson about theft. Totally clueless!
Look for more store closures in the area.
That Wood Village Store is very busy though. I didn't feel particularly safe at that store, but it was better than these two that are closing. I did go there at 10 PM.
My concern is Wal Mart tends to do a nice job attracting a lot of issues (theft, etc.). If they close those issues will not go away, they will just go to whatever retailers are left in the areas. Then what? Do those retailers end up having to close too?
The situation for retailers in Portland has become very strange and the attitude of city leadership is odd. I am wondering if the lack of sales tax being generated somehow makes city leadership have this attitude. I was shocked Nike's request was denied.
Sometimes the talk about Portland is so confusing for me from afar. I really want to visit in person, soon.
A very close friend of mine visits Portland and southern Washington every year. His experience is the opposite of what I hear. His photos do not support the negative chatter. He is a social media fanatic.
babs wrote: ↑February 23rd, 2023, 10:50 am
Walmart has been a non-factor in the Portland area. I'm not sure if there is any other metro area where Walmart has a smaller presence/market share than Portland. From the tough land-use laws making large stores hard to site to city officials doing whatever they can to block them, this isn't an area where Walmart does much business.
The Oregonian story above is a joke as the writer failed to mention the real reason these store is closing is because of massive theft issues. She doesn't even seem to bother to ask the Walmart spokesperson about theft. Totally clueless!
Look for more store closures in the area.
That Wood Village Store is very busy though. I didn't feel particularly safe at that store, but it was better than these two that are closing. I did go there at 10 PM.
My concern is Wal Mart tends to do a nice job attracting a lot of issues (theft, etc.). If they close those issues will not go away, they will just go to whatever retailers are left in the areas. Then what? Do those retailers end up having to close too?
The situation for retailers in Portland has become very strange and the attitude of city leadership is odd. I am wondering if the lack of sales tax being generated somehow makes city leadership have this attitude. I was shocked Nike's request was denied.
Sometimes the talk about Portland is so confusing for me from afar. I really want to visit in person, soon.
A very close friend of mine visits Portland and southern Washington every year. His experience is the opposite of what I hear. His photos do not support the negative chatter. He is a social media fanatic.
Confused
There are many delightful areas there. The core city of Portland itself is a mess though.
