Vons closing Vista store

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Bluelightspecial
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by Bluelightspecial »

I may be wrong, but I think there is a way to rebrand "some" of the stores to increase volume and profit. For example, in Laguna Niguel in Orange County on Crown Valley Parkway there was a Vons that had to be be sold to Smart n Final during the Albertsons buyout. It was actually a smaller older Ralphs store that Vons took over when Ralphs bought Alpha Beta. Not more than two blocks away is a large Albertsons. It is in a high income area and would be a better fit as a Pavilions like they did when they converted the Laguna Niguel Vons to a Pavilions. In the Coachella Valley there used to be a Pavilions in Rancho Mirage that was very successful. It had to be sold off during the Albertsons buyout and is now a Gelsons. There is another huge Albertsons in Rancho Mirage that would be a much better high end grocer like a Pavilions.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by storewanderer »

Bluelightspecial wrote: June 21st, 2022, 9:54 pm I may be wrong, but I think there is a way to rebrand "some" of the stores to increase volume and profit. For example, in Laguna Niguel in Orange County on Crown Valley Parkway there was a Vons that had to be be sold to Smart n Final during the Albertsons buyout. It was actually a smaller older Ralphs store that Vons took over when Ralphs bought Alpha Beta. Not more than two blocks away is a large Albertsons. It is in a high income area and would be a better fit as a Pavilions like they did when they converted the Laguna Niguel Vons to a Pavilions. In the Coachella Valley there used to be a Pavilions in Rancho Mirage that was very successful. It had to be sold off during the Albertsons buyout and is now a Gelsons. There is another huge Albertsons in Rancho Mirage that would be a much better high end grocer like a Pavilions.
They could also just modify the mix in the Albertsons... to be more higher end in Rancho Mirage.

Given the volume flex in that market depending on what time of year it was, that type of approach may work better. Not sure how impacted that specific store is depending what time of year it is but I know some stores in that market are really slow during the off season.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by ClownLoach »

Bluelightspecial wrote: June 21st, 2022, 9:54 pm I may be wrong, but I think there is a way to rebrand "some" of the stores to increase volume and profit. For example, in Laguna Niguel in Orange County on Crown Valley Parkway there was a Vons that had to be be sold to Smart n Final during the Albertsons buyout. It was actually a smaller older Ralphs store that Vons took over when Ralphs bought Alpha Beta. Not more than two blocks away is a large Albertsons. It is in a high income area and would be a better fit as a Pavilions like they did when they converted the Laguna Niguel Vons to a Pavilions. In the Coachella Valley there used to be a Pavilions in Rancho Mirage that was very successful. It had to be sold off during the Albertsons buyout and is now a Gelsons. There is another huge Albertsons in Rancho Mirage that would be a much better high end grocer like a Pavilions.
I'm not really sure what to say about this type of rebranding now. That Laguna Niguel Vons seemed to be doing better as Vons than Pavilions which probably led to the recent expense of downsizing the store. Because of decades of mismanagement under Safeway the Pavilions brand was tainted and got the reputation of being a Vons with higher prices and nothing else. Heck in some cases it meant an older and dingy store than Vons. I would not be surprised if customers to this day drive past a Pavilions close to home to shop at Vons or Albertsons because they believe that the prices will be lower despite the fact that all 3 are sky high now. The recent efforts to tie the Pavilions brand to stores with higher performing liquor departments, specifically wine, to regain share from BevMo and Total Wine doesn't have much pull in the market. Pavilions still costs more. The name change proposed in arguably the most expensive market in California (Montecito) appears to have died on the vine. It is going to take a while for customers to return to Pavilions and discover that the stores are once again more than a Vons in more ways than price. Marketing the Pavilions name again might help, but it would bring up prices as well.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by storewanderer »

ClownLoach wrote: June 21st, 2022, 11:10 pm

I'm not really sure what to say about this type of rebranding now. That Laguna Niguel Vons seemed to be doing better as Vons than Pavilions which probably led to the recent expense of downsizing the store. Because of decades of mismanagement under Safeway the Pavilions brand was tainted and got the reputation of being a Vons with higher prices and nothing else. Heck in some cases it meant an older and dingy store than Vons. I would not be surprised if customers to this day drive past a Pavilions close to home to shop at Vons or Albertsons because they believe that the prices will be lower despite the fact that all 3 are sky high now. The recent efforts to tie the Pavilions brand to stores with higher performing liquor departments, specifically wine, to regain share from BevMo and Total Wine doesn't have much pull in the market. Pavilions still costs more. The name change proposed in arguably the most expensive market in California (Montecito) appears to have died on the vine. It is going to take a while for customers to return to Pavilions and discover that the stores are once again more than a Vons in more ways than price. Marketing the Pavilions name again might help, but it would bring up prices as well.
Pavilions should not have prices higher than Vons for identical perimeter department items. If it is something is special to Pavilions and bigger and better than Vons (like the muffins) then okay. But for the same pre made service case pasta salads to be $1/lb higher is not really a great strategy.

It is also my observation these Pavilions Stores tend to be, how should I put it, not exactly high volume operations. They seem to do less business than a typical Albertsons or Vons.

Albertsons had a good run under COVID but especially this year all I am seeing with them is price increases, worse perimeters, SKU cuts, and out of stock problems that seem to be worse than many other chains. I'm pretty down on both Albertsons and Kroger. I am glad there are a lot of regional chains out there to provide competition still because these national chains are really lacking in a lot of ways.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by veteran+ »

Bluelightspecial wrote: June 21st, 2022, 9:54 pm I may be wrong, but I think there is a way to rebrand "some" of the stores to increase volume and profit. For example, in Laguna Niguel in Orange County on Crown Valley Parkway there was a Vons that had to be be sold to Smart n Final during the Albertsons buyout. It was actually a smaller older Ralphs store that Vons took over when Ralphs bought Alpha Beta. Not more than two blocks away is a large Albertsons. It is in a high income area and would be a better fit as a Pavilions like they did when they converted the Laguna Niguel Vons to a Pavilions. In the Coachella Valley there used to be a Pavilions in Rancho Mirage that was very successful. It had to be sold off during the Albertsons buyout and is now a Gelsons. There is another huge Albertsons in Rancho Mirage that would be a much better high end grocer like a Pavilions.
That Pavilions in Rancho Mirage was indeed high volume (for the desert) and very difficult to manage, clientele wise (HIGH maintenance).

Which Albertsons are you talking about? The one on Vista Chino?
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by Bluelightspecial »

No it is on Country Club Dr and Monterey. It's right across the street from a Bristol Farms.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by Bluelightspecial »

ClownLoach wrote: June 21st, 2022, 11:10 pm
Bluelightspecial wrote: June 21st, 2022, 9:54 pm I may be wrong, but I think there is a way to rebrand "some" of the stores to increase volume and profit. For example, in Laguna Niguel in Orange County on Crown Valley Parkway there was a Vons that had to be be sold to Smart n Final during the Albertsons buyout. It was actually a smaller older Ralphs store that Vons took over when Ralphs bought Alpha Beta. Not more than two blocks away is a large Albertsons. It is in a high income area and would be a better fit as a Pavilions like they did when they converted the Laguna Niguel Vons to a Pavilions. In the Coachella Valley there used to be a Pavilions in Rancho Mirage that was very successful. It had to be sold off during the Albertsons buyout and is now a Gelsons. There is another huge Albertsons in Rancho Mirage that would be a much better high end grocer like a Pavilions.
I'm not really sure what to say about this type of rebranding now. That Laguna Niguel Vons seemed to be doing better as Vons than Pavilions which probably led to the recent expense of downsizing the store. Because of decades of mismanagement under Safeway the Pavilions brand was tainted and got the reputation of being a Vons with higher prices and nothing else. Heck in some cases it meant an older and dingy store than Vons. I would not be surprised if customers to this day drive past a Pavilions close to home to shop at Vons or Albertsons because they believe that the prices will be lower despite the fact that all 3 are sky high now. The recent efforts to tie the Pavilions brand to stores with higher performing liquor departments, specifically wine, to regain share from BevMo and Total Wine doesn't have much pull in the market. Pavilions still costs more. The name change proposed in arguably the most expensive market in California (Montecito) appears to have died on the vine. It is going to take a while for customers to return to Pavilions and discover that the stores are once again more than a Vons in more ways than price. Marketing the Pavilions name again might help, but it would bring up prices as well.
I don't know how the Laguna Niguel store is doing as a Pavilions. I do know it was originally built above the Safeway standard square footage for the area of 48 to 60 sq/ft. Reducing the size of the store probably would have happened even if they didn't rebrand. As for Montecito, my guess it may be an issue with the landlord. I don't think there is any love lost between the landlord and now Albertsons. Albertsons may have the lease options, but at one point Vons put a pharmacy in one of the other storefronts and the landlord terminated the lease and now the pharmacy is in an entirely different center behind the store. I suspect the Landlord would prefer a Bristol Farms or Whole Foods in that center.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by storewanderer »

Bluelightspecial wrote: June 22nd, 2022, 6:16 pm
I don't know how the Laguna Niguel store is doing as a Pavilions. I do know it was originally built above the Safeway standard square footage for the area of 48 to 60 sq/ft. Reducing the size of the store probably would have happened even if they didn't rebrand. As for Montecito, my guess it may be an issue with the landlord. I don't think there is any love lost between the landlord and now Albertsons. Albertsons may have the lease options, but at one point Vons put a pharmacy in one of the other storefronts and the landlord terminated the lease and now the pharmacy is in an entirely different center behind the store. I suspect the Landlord would prefer a Bristol Farms or Whole Foods in that center.
Montecito Vons has decent enough reviews so it looks like it works there. I wonder how long the lease has. If they aren't going to convert to Pavilions they should at least renovate the store assuming they have 5-10 years left. The Lifestyle interiors have gotten really run down badly in smaller/busier stores. They still look kind of okay in larger/less busy stores.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by ClownLoach »

storewanderer wrote: June 22nd, 2022, 7:10 pm
Bluelightspecial wrote: June 22nd, 2022, 6:16 pm
I don't know how the Laguna Niguel store is doing as a Pavilions. I do know it was originally built above the Safeway standard square footage for the area of 48 to 60 sq/ft. Reducing the size of the store probably would have happened even if they didn't rebrand. As for Montecito, my guess it may be an issue with the landlord. I don't think there is any love lost between the landlord and now Albertsons. Albertsons may have the lease options, but at one point Vons put a pharmacy in one of the other storefronts and the landlord terminated the lease and now the pharmacy is in an entirely different center behind the store. I suspect the Landlord would prefer a Bristol Farms or Whole Foods in that center.
Montecito Vons has decent enough reviews so it looks like it works there. I wonder how long the lease has. If they aren't going to convert to Pavilions they should at least renovate the store assuming they have 5-10 years left. The Lifestyle interiors have gotten really run down badly in smaller/busier stores. They still look kind of okay in larger/less busy stores.
I have to get into the store to see what happened inside. They definitely had some construction underway when they posted signage inside the store about "your new Pavilions coming soon" and there are very few Yelp or Google pictures of this store; some are clearly the Cliff Dr. Vons across town. I wonder what was finished - if they did the basic remodel work for Pavilions without changing the decor which could be done quickly later - or if they just put everything back the way it was and halted the project.

On another thread there was discussion about signage - that Vons is extremely old and predated intense signage restrictions in the area. The part of the permit application for signage was denied. By trying to change the sign to Pavilions they would no longer be grandfathered in and have to change to a little tiny sign that is not backlit plastic. The entire sign would probably be smaller than just the V on the current Vons sign. Therefore it would make zero sense based on the oddball design of the strip mall to change the name if nobody could see the sign anymore. This would also be a deterrent potentially to other brands. Despite the upscale Santa Barbara market both the Whole Foods and new Bristol Farms seem to underperform. Bristol took the wrong location, a Vons in the dead mall on upper State. Whole Foods is in a very small old Circuit City. This Montecito Vons may be smaller than both. Bristol seems to now build prototypical stores all the same size, a big change from their past of custom designing the interior and layout of each building (Irvine is an exception as a test store, but all the other recent builds and remodels are identical Mulholland, Manhattan Beach, Yorba Linda and Santa Barbara). And retail staffing, really any staffing of any kind has famously been extraordinarily difficult in the Santa Barbara area so I'm not sure who would want to sign up for a new store there as no employee could afford to live anywhere nearby on retail wages. I think the only one who would consider taking the site if Vons left would be Target, at least until they stop playing with tiny store formats.
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Re: Vons closing Vista store

Post by retailfanmitchell019 »

storewanderer wrote: June 20th, 2022, 8:42 pm Looks like it will make a great Grocery Outlet location. The irony is they'd remodel the space, put in a new ceiling, etc. Not saying I've heard they will take the location but it would be a great fit.
That would be a good bet. However, I'm hoping Stater Bros takes it.
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