Pavilions #1 Garden Grove

[steps]

What lead to the decline of the very first Pavilions store? I remember shopping here with my aunt in the late 1980's and the store was huge (assuming the biggest Pavilions ever?). The area was pretty upper middle class if I remember correctly. The store was impressive at the time with the "grand" driveway that lead you to the store. The streets and plaza names still associate with the Pavilions that was there from what I have read. I haven't been to Garden Grove in at least 25yrs, has the demographics changed to cause this store to close?

[submariner]

Are you talking about the one at Brookhurst and Chapman?

[steps]

I have been having trouble logging in and now the board won't let me use the "enter" key!

But, yes, the one on Chapman in Garden Grove. Was wondering what happened?

[klkla]

There was a very successful Vons in that shopping center before the Pavilions opened which influenced their decision to place the first store there. When Pavilions opened the store it got a lot of attention but was never very high volume. If I remember correctly it was doing around $400,000 a week in volume at first and then declined to a range of $250,000 - $300,000 a couple years later.

I remember a conversation with one of the VP's back then and he explained that the original concept wasn't going to be gourmet or upscale per se. They wanted a store to appeal to middle income to upper middle income shoppers they referred to as 'foodies'. But most importantly they wanted a format that did not have to promote as many loss-leaders in their advertisements as Vons was doing so that they could make more profit in the neighborhoods that could support it. Of the initial nine stores four failed right away and were either closed or converted to other formats within a couple years. They figured out pretty quick that the stores needed a wealthier clientele to be successful.

The demographics of the neighborhood has changed and is more Asian than before (there's an Asian supermarket in the shopping center now).

[pseudo3d]

There was a very successful Vons in that shopping center before the Pavilions opened which influenced their decision to place the first store there. When Pavilions opened the store it got a lot of attention but was never very high volume. If I remember correctly it was doing around $400,000 a week in volume at first and then declined to a range of $250,000 - $300,000 a couple years later.

I remember a conversation with one of the VP's back then and he explained that the original concept wasn't going to be gourmet or upscale per se. They wanted a store to appeal to middle income to upper middle income shoppers they referred to as 'foodies'. But most importantly they wanted a format that did not have to promote as many loss-leaders in their advertisements as Vons was doing so that they could make more profit in the neighborhoods that could support it. Of the initial nine stores four failed right away and were either closed or converted to other formats within a couple years. They figured out pretty quick that the stores needed a wealthier clientele to be successful.

The demographics of the neighborhood has changed and is more Asian than before (there's an Asian supermarket in the shopping center now).

So basically a Trader Joe's before there really was such a thing?

[klkla]

So basically a Trader Joe's before there really was such a thing?

Trader Joes has actually been around since the late 60's. It was pretty much just in the greater L.A. are until the 90's and then they started expanding all over the country. Their stores are still pretty similar to what they were the first time I ever went into one which was in the mid 80's.

[pseudo3d]

So basically a Trader Joe's before there really was such a thing?

Trader Joes has actually been around since the late 60's. It was pretty much just in the greater L.A. are until the 90's and then they started expanding all over the country. Their stores are still pretty similar to what they were the first time I ever went into one which was in the mid 80's.

Interesting. So what's the closest living relative to what Pavilions was supposed to be?

[klkla]

So what's the closest living relative to what Pavilions was supposed to be?

Here in SoCal Ralphs Fresh Fare is pretty similar to what was envisioned for Pavilions. Other chains that run conventional stores with an upscale twist are Wegmans and Haggen (the original PNW version).

[storewanderer]

I think a conventional United vs a United Market Street is a good non SoCal example. Agree on Ralphs Fresh Fare being the closest thing in SoCal; those used to run different ads also but I think they're on pretty much the same ad now as standard Ralphs (but different Ralphs run different ads on fresh items depending on neighborhood.)

[CalItalian]

I think a conventional United vs a United Market Street is a good non SoCal example. Agree on Ralphs Fresh Fare being the closest thing in SoCal; those used to run different ads also but I think they're on pretty much the same ad now as standard Ralphs (but different Ralphs run different ads on fresh items depending on neighborhood.)

Ralphs Fresh Fare locations never ran different ads vs. a normal Ralphs other than a few additional items. You could always get the same advertised price (except USDA Choice meat) as a regular Ralphs. The first Ralphs Fresh Fare was the location on Wilshire & Bundy in West L.A. (down the street from the O.J. crime scene). I was there the day they had their grand re-opening. Always been a smaller sized Ralphs.

The biggest difference in a Ralphs Fresh Fare today is Ralphs Fresh Fare has USDA Prime beef as well as USDA Choice. In the beginning, Ralphs Fresh Fare locations had USDA Choice only (the only other chain store at the time that only carried USDA Choice was Hughes Markets). Some higher priced wines and a few gourmet items are about the only difference (and normally a little higher regular priced and non-advertised sale items).

All Ralphs, Vons and Albertsons have USDA Choice meat only in Southern California. That's been the biggest change over the years. Vons & Pavilions never discounted their nearing expiration date meat with 30-50% off tag coupons like they do know before Albertsons bought them, too. Ralphs has marked it down for as long as I can remember.